If You're Going Through Hell

[kayc]

Gin, as long as you were prescribed it, you can take it.  If it's expired, make them call in a new one.  You're in my thoughts and prayers, dear Gin, Monday can't come soon enough!

[Gwenivere]

I received an email from a buddy this morning and was stunned by his take on my grief.  He totally negates his judgement of me in the last sentence.   This is what he sent.....

*************

I’m sorry you feel so helpless, forlorn, and depressed. I wish I could help but you know this is all up to you. You’d have to change your thoughts and make a decent attempt to move on if you really want a sea change in your life. You’ve already lived out the miserable and alone lifestyle. If you want something else you only have to make the determination to live a different life. No one else is going to pull you out of this one but you and I know you dislike sympathy, consoling, and coddling. You aren’t the first and you won’t be the last to go through the loss of a mate. If you want to recover, find a way. It ain’t easy and I don’t judge or deny how it would devastate me or anyone else.

***************

I'm still reeling from reading this. I don’t argue we have to make different lives now, but saying outlived my grief?  People write things that sound benign to them.  Maybe I am overreacting.  All I know is I woke to another day of hell to find this.  This from a person who has so many people in his life that he complains about it and is always telling me about the things he and his wife are doing AND how it keeps him sane as we find limits creeping in with age.  I so want to call him and scream he hasn’t a clue.  He sees his mother in law, a widow, carrying on and doing OK.   That is his reference point.  Makes me wonder how many other people would or do view me the same way.   It’s a crossroad I have had before that I wonder if this time I would feel better confronting as writing it off is getting so hard.  When I was presented with things I could not relate to I always said I wish I knew what to say because I knew I could not possibly know how the person felt.  How could I advise someone about something I had no knowledge of?  Oh, how I wish he had said....I don’t know what to say. I appreciate that more as it is the truth and doesn’t invalidate me.  Now I just want to sob at the added loneliness it makes me feel.  But I’ve lived that out already according to him.  I guess I’m a terrible duck at letting things roll of my back.  I would give anything to have just one person I could sit with physically and cry to.  They wouldn’t have to understand it all, but the aloneness of this killing me.

[Margm]

2 hours ago, Gwenivere said:

I wonder if this time I would feel better confronting

Do you know how to block email accounts?  Please block this "buddy" off your list.  Confronting is not going to help.  Karma is a bitch.  I know you are not religious, but there is something in the Bible that says "vengeance is mine" and I always beg him to let me watch just once.  He has not got back to me on that.  

[Gin]

I have my CT scan early in the morning.  Taking contrast barium tonight.  I have lots of pain and sure miss Al to go with me.  

[TomPB]

16 hours ago, Gin said:

I have my CT scan early in the morning.  Taking contrast barium tonight.  I have lots of pain and sure miss Al to go with me.  

Totally Understood Gin best wishes TomPB.

ps You hit one of the things I dread. I'm in (apparently) good health, but the prospect down the road of being hospitalized without Susan by my side makes me hope for sudden death. I hope you handle it better than me. 

[scba]

DEarGwen,

If you don't know what to do, check again Tim Lawrence's article: You are not wallowing, and the related ones.

Then, follow Marg´s advise. Remove that account. Make it go to SPAM. 

[Widowedbysuicide]

I am so very sorry that you received such a hurtful message. 

When people you know do this to you it sure slams you into the hard ground.  It takes your breath away and breaks your heart a little more each time.  I wish I had the solution to dealing with these situations in a way that educates the person but does not leave me with more sorrow in my life.

Some say that these people don't mean to hurt us and that we should be more understanding.  The words from a friend hurt more than those of an enemy.  The betrayal is horrific feeling.  I am glad you can come here to share with those of us who are supportive and have some real understanding.  I find myself searching for only those people who can understand; trying to find a safe place to be myself.  I have not been very successful and each time I must suffer the thoughtlessness of others my grief deepensdeepens.

I'm sending you a prayer and a hug and I will continue to wish for more kindness to enter your world.

[Gwenivere]

Thank you Marg, Marita and Ana.  I told another outsider about it and she couldn’t understand why it hurt so much.  I’m not going to cut the guy off, but I did leave him a message to talk voice as I want to tell him how I feel and most importantly, don’t give unsolicited advice on something you know nothing about firsthand.  Grief doesn’t need any more allies like stress, conflict and added pain.  It’s true this hurts more from some one you know.  Strangers are easy to blow off.  Hugs to you all for being there.  💖

Gin, I hope the best for you Monday.  Medical stuff is a big trigger for me too now.  Didn’t used to be, but it’s the fact I am really alone that has changed everything.  

[Margm]

Dear Gin, my heart is with you, but I know that is not what you want.  I sure wish you luck.  The hurting is a constant with me after the ruptured colon, but I cannot take anything but Tylenol.  It is my lower back in constant pain, but I can only walk it off.  Because of the massive amount of radiation I had so many years ago, the "innards" cannot be fixed.  Nothing will hold a stitch and because of the damage already done, nothing else can be fixed.  If I keep taking the MyraLax and don't eat anything I am not supposed to eat, maybe I can drag time on.  I guess we all are living on borrowed time anyhow and we learn to accept each day given as a true gift, and it is hard to think of it as that, but we are still here and here we will stay until we can't.  Billy was emptying the bag attached to me for weeks in 2014.  In 2015, he and the bag both were gone.  I live with the pain of both.  No fun, just fact.  

Gwen, even if you "talk" to your "buddy" you will not educate him to the difference in empathy and sympathy, but honestly, he seems to not understand either.  My heart is with both Gin and Gwen, at this time.  Does not help heal hurts though, just empathize.  

Addendum:  Funny thing happened today.  When I get totally stressed, like my trembling chin and fingers, my voice takes on a new wobbly variation, clipped wobbly words.  My sister wanted to know what was wrong.  Honestly, I cannot help the voice shaking any more than the extremities so I told her it was a bad day.  She mentioned the word "wallowing" and I told her about Rose Kennedy and our Grandma, and our grandma at 18 years saying it was like yesterday.  And, she came back with a reasonable comparison, you wallow if you have broken up with someone, you hurt if that person is really gone.  Yeah!!!!  So much for that.  See, my feelings are not hurt.  Stand up for yourself against these people or say this "No, there is nothing wrong, I am doing fine."  They know you aren't.  Not your worry.  

[kayc]

16 hours ago, Gwenivere said:

but saying outlived my grief?

I read it and reread but don't see where it says that.
 

[kayc]

11 hours ago, Gin said:

I have my CT scan early in the morning.  Taking contrast barium tonight.  I have lots of pain and sure miss Al to go with me.  

Thinking of you today, let us know when you find out something.  I'm glad you made it through the weekend (I know, what choice is there sometimes) I just hope they come up with a solution and FAST!

[Gwenivere]

6 hours ago, kayc said:

I read it and reread but don't see where it says that.

That is how I interpret his saying 'you’ve already lived out the miserable and alone lifestyle' followed by if you want to recover, find  a way.

[Margm]

On 4/30/2018 at 2:22 AM, Gwenivere said:

 I told another outsider about it and she couldn’t understand why it hurt so much.  

The reason I come to this forum is to get the wisdom and share the feelings with those who think like me.  Now, even some of you do not think like me, but one thing we all share is respect for the other's grief.  Is it worse than mine?  I don't know, I only know how I feel and I am savvy enough to know that if you have spent 20 years grieving or 20 weeks, we are all in some sort of pain.  Now, my family, they respect my grief, sometimes we discuss our combined grief, sometimes we laugh about what  "Daddy" did, how he thought, the things he would do.  Sometimes we all just grieve and we all share in the emotional diagnosis of depression.  That is why I come to  this forum.  My friends, they are all in different stages of grief or "not" grief.  I do not discuss it with them.  I will not go back and visit my friend, the one who was so cold to me, not because I do not have empathy for her, but this is her walk of life and I cannot take the grief from her and cannot share her grief.  He has been in the nursing home for months now..  Another friend my age went for a heart cath this morning.  I see her Facebook notices and I know she is in pain caring for a husband she has nursed through cancer only to have him fall into dementia hard.  Grief is like cancer, it hits the rich, famous, infamous, poor, very unfortunate people all the same.  Another friend is facing losing another husband.  I cannot take her pain off her.  She knows I am here for her, but she knows this walk of grief already and this one might be worse than the first, or it might be the same.  I think Joan Didion, the author, I think her husband died while they were just talking to each other.  Some die all different ways, but, however, they go, the shock to  us left is still the same.  We are never ready for it.  When they go we suffer guilt, abandonment, anger, shock, all the things Kubler-Ross wrote about that I do not like to read.  Sometimes the truth hurts very much.  The fact I was not holding Billy through his last moments will always hurt me, but in my crazy mind, I was not letting him leave.  My mind was made up, I steadfast was not letting him leave.  He left anyhow.  And none of my friends really care to hear this from me, so I do not discuss it with any of them.  No one understands me but some of you on this forum, and I am not sure everyone understands because our loved ones left in different ways.  The thing we all understand is pain and loss.  No one else understands that, so I don't talk to them.................but, I do talk to you, and you, and you..  

[scba]

Marg,

I left the ICU room and refused to go back when the nurse told me it was time say goodbye, my bf was having a heart attack. I said loud in my soul "I will not say goodbye".

I refused to enter into the room after he passed. 

He died anyhow, and I did not say goodbye. 

I understand what you did.

[Margm]

Ana,, I understand what I did too and I forgive me, and I know he does too.  He knew I could not let him go.  No, we could not say goodbye, none of us.  

Went back and read your brave exit, not saying goodbye, and Darcie's never saying goodbye, and no, that is not something we can do.  We can say I love you, but we can never say goodbye.  My heart to you.

[Gwenivere]

I never said good bye to Steve.  Every day I visited him in hospice I said I’ll see you tomorrow.  I knew it would end and saw a couple of days before.  But I could never say those words.  I never will.  I will never let him go.  

(Added after Marty's post).........

Always my last words were I love you.  Thanks for posting that, Marty.  Where is it from?  

[MartyT]

Goodbye to Goodbye, by Darcie Sims ❤️

[Margm]

We were never to leave without saying "I love you" and this time I cannot turn the car around and make sure I said it, but I am sure he heard an echo of the one hundred billion times I said it over those 54 years, and the trillion times since he left.  And "I love you Darcie," cause we don't say goodbye.

[kayc]

Marg,

Hearing you talk about the different ones you know losing their spouse to dementia, etc...

It makes me feel I am blessed because I know my parents would have been there for each other through thick and thin, even dementia.  Daddy died 32 1/2 years before my mom did, but she never remarried and yep, she had dementia, stage 4 before she entered the dementia care unit.  But there's some kind of assurance in knowing the love they had for each other, that regardless of my mom's craziness (sorry Dr Phil, don't know what else to call it) or my dad's drinking, their love was there.

[Margm]

I cannot deny my parents must have had love or dependence one, he loved her for being able to depend on her his last over four years of care before the  cancer took him..  Our pastor told us that the prostate cancer that took his own father, warned Mama of the pain Daddy was going to face.  Mama got angry with him for warning her and perhaps it was not the most tactful path to take to talk to her, but she was forewarned, and our pastor was not wrong.  He went through so much pain he had decubitus ulcers on his heels from digging them into the egg crate mattress for the weeks he was in the hospital.  The snog machine used to remove the excess secretions, the horror of it all, and finally withdrawing any support but "comfort" care, which was really no comfort.  She stuck right with him, but foremost in her mind was also taking care of herself.  She may have had mental problems, she may not have offered love and cherished the moments with him, it was all business with her, but I admired her steadfastness with the hospital course, us all staying through the Cheyne-Stokes breathing and hoping each long pause would be the end of his pain, and she was so happy he had a smile on his face when he left.  She did not hide from the horror, but she did take care of herself.  I guess there was nothing else she could do.  What I took to be coldness on her part I now see was probably shock..  I am reminded of my own feelings, but my feelings were not letting go, her's were not only  letting go, but actually relief.  I can now see why.  At least Billy's course was short, pain great at times, but still short compared to his dad's and mine.  We do what we have to do.  We handle it the best we can.  One of my friends just lost her middle aged son to this disease.  Wish they could find a cure.  They have come a long way with curing some types that used to be fatal.  I lived through the treatments only to have the treatments attack me over 30 years later.  I had Billy to depend on.  We both thought I would go first.  Then, you wonder why your here.

[Margm]

Scott and I keep in touch by phone, Facebook messenger   We are in touch every day, or at least 4-5 times or more a week.  He came down and stayed at least two weeks and I sure miss him when he is gone.  Come to find out, I had not seen him since October, didn't realize that.  In fact, there are a lot of things I don't realize and am not sure I care to be reminded.  Honestly had a melt down this morning, not because of Billy being gone, just had to tell everybody I'm tired of taking care of everybody and it is time they all took care of me.  Sometimes I read some of your posts and I worry about you, but sometimes also you can have so much worry put on your back you realize, Damn, I am an old woman and it is time someone took care of me.  Billy and I have too many years involved in taking care of everything, we gave up so much to take care of everybody that sometimes when you are by yourself you get to where you think, it would just be so easy to just let go.  Did you know you can get yourself into a bad fix if you decide to let go.  I scared me.  Billy told me when I was so sick that if I died the people left would be the ones that were left with the worry and that rascal had to prove himself right.  Kinda scary how easy it is to let go though.  My mama wanted to leave and that little spark of Alzheimer's in her brain would not release her.  Cancer will kill a person but Alzheimer's will leave a spark burning in a useless body.  And Life used to  be a magazine.  Kelli found an apartment and will be moved back "home" next wee

 

[Gwenivere]

I had PT yesterday and my pain level went from it’s usual 6-7 to a 9.  It’s so frustrating having to accept the former painfree life is over.   Best they hope for Is manageable levels to avoid back surgery which I can’t handle alone.

What I have been very aware of is times of day everything kinds crashes in.  Mine are when I get home and have the night facing me.  I know that seems obvious, but it’s getting worse.  Twice a night I get into this twilight zone where I feel the walls closing in on me.  Driving home I had this feeling of 'it is was it is' and in counseling it was suggested I play around with the bleak thoughts to try and change thier intensity.  Always sounds good at the time.  But I close the house up when darkness comes.  I keep trying to think of changes but the anxiety takes over.  I so want back what is not possible.  Does anyone else have a pattern of times that are hard?  No matter what,  they just lay in wait.  I fall back into the usual nightly routine then again feeling like I’ve surrendered to it.

[kayc]

Gwen,

I wonder if there isn't an aide that could come stay with you while recovering from back surgery?  Someone who could also feed the dogs and let them out to do their business?  I don't know your financial situation so that may not be feasible for you but it seems you can have anything for a price.  I am so sorry you're in so much pain.

I'm struggling right now, with sense of purpose, etc. don't know why as it's getting to the sunnier time of year, I should be feeling better, not worse.  Maybe it's because it's getting closer to June (George's birthday, my dad's birthday, my folk's anv. and George's death day).  All within nine days of each other.

[kayc]

22 hours ago, Marg M said:

What I took to be coldness on her part I now see was probably shock..

When my dad died my mom did not shed a tear at his funeral, but came home and immediately cleaned out his closet and started throwing away his belongings.  At the time it shocked me and I took it for her being unaffected by his death.

I now realize I was wrong.  We all grieve differently.  She may have been in shock.  I've learned in the time since not to judge anyone's reactions to grief as it's such a crazy time, shock, grief fog, disbelief, we deal with it all at once!  If we look off our rockers, it's no wonder!

[Margm]

They had a home nurse and physical therapist come out a couple of times a week each for Billy, for such a short time, but they kept up with him and stayed as long as we needed them.  We did not ask for this, it was provided by something, I am not sure what, Medicare?  Maybe our group insurance.  We did not ask for it, they were just there.