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Recently Lost My Dad


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I am 25 years old and in March 2016 my world came to a crashing stop.  Literally.  My dad, who was 57 years old, was traveling to work, in Amish country, and got into a car accident and died.  The last 2 months have been a whirlwind of things going on.  My mom is only 46.  I have a younger brother at 22.  My dad was the bread winner of the family.  With his passing, there has been a lot of change that has to occur.  We haven't paid off our house so now we have to move because we cannot afford it.  We have to watch our money, which I'm not use to.  I worked 2 jobs and go to school full time.  I use to be a work/school-a-holic.  Now I have motivation for nothing. Nothing but helping my mom and fixing the house to sell.  People tell me that I have to start living my life not my mom's or the houses but it is easier said than done.  One little thing sends me into a tear fest.  So I have to participate in an online support group for school and thought this could be beneficial for not only myself but my schooling.  This is my first time ever participating in anything like this and I'm very nervous and am scared with what emotions and such will come out of it.

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Dear Katie,

I am so very sorry that you and your family have lost your dad in this horrible way. This is such a shock for all of you. Dramatic change often happens when there is a death in the family and it sounds like you are dealing with many issues. The fact that you are/were going to school and holding down two jobs says that you are a very determined young lady. I am sure you are doing everything to help your mom and other people's advice to you no doubt comes from good intentions but it is you and your family that have to do what you have to do. 

You and your brother will need to focus on your grief just as your mom will need to focus on hers. I hope you will be able to find a good grief counselor who will guide you through this trauma. We will be here to listen and give you encouragement. There are many good articles to read about losing a parent in such a sudden way. When you are ready I'm sure suggestions will be offered. 

Right now you and your family need to take care of each other. Do what you have to do. Try to care for yourselves for that will help you as you deal with what you have to do. Sending hugs and please continue to come here and share. 

Anne

 

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Dear one, I agree completely with all that Anne has said to you. You are doing the best you can in the face of this shocking, unspeakable loss, and for now, just let that be enough.

At times like this it is easy to forget or to neglect your own basic needs (for rest, nutrition, hydration, and exercise). Make sure that you pay attention to the simple things that will keep you as healthy as possible. You need every ounce of strength you can muster to get through this. 

I hope you've let your employers and your teachers know what is happening in your life. Perhaps under the circumstances, they'd be willing to work with you to make some adjustments in your schedule, as it sounds as if you're carrying a very heavy load.

I don't know how you found your way to this particular online support group, but I hope it gives you comfort to know that you're now among some of the most caring, compassionate and loving people you'll find anywhere. You are one of us now, and we will walk beside you as you find your way through this challenging time. You are not alone. You have found a very safe place to land. 

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I am so sorry you lost your dad, I know this is hard for all of you and the last thing in the world you expected.  You've already received some very good counsel here.  Maybe your mom could talk to a community college advisor about going to school, sometimes with scholarships you can come out with enough to live on and she can find a way to take care of herself.  If she does decide to let the bank have the house back, I wouldn't get in a hurry to move, it can take a year or longer for it to foreclose on.  Sometimes they prefer people to stay in it even though they aren't getting anything because it keeps the house in heat, and looked after, the wheels turn slow.  I know some people who lived in their house for free for two years and the banks still haven't moved to evict them.

Right now it's a lot just to try and process your grief, and your mom hers, and your brother his.  I hope you are able to continue with your schooling, but if you feel you can't, I hope you will talk to the school guidance counselor about taking some time off, or testing later, or whatever they can work out for you, be sure and let them know what is going on.

I'm glad you found this site, we're here to listen and let you know you have been heard.  My heart goes out to all of you, I know this is quite a shock.

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Katie, I am so sorry to hear about your losing your dad-it is really awful. I think losing a parent changes the way the world is configured as you see it. I lost my dad in January after taking care of him as he declined from Parkinson's Disease, and I thought that was hard, but having him gone is so much more difficult. I am glad you have found this site-it has been tremendously helpful to me...the people are so supportive, loving and helpful. Please remember to take care of yourself, because when you're in grief like this, you really aren't all there and so need to be extra careful driving, walking, or using anything that could injure a person.  -Laura

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8 hours ago, kayc said:

 decide to let the bank have the house back, I wouldn't get in a hurry to move, it can take a year or longer for it to foreclose on.  Sometimes they prefer people to stay in it even though they aren't getting anything because it keeps the house in heat, and looked after, the wheels turn slow.  I know some people who lived in their house for free for two years and the banks still haven't moved to evict them.

Kay, can you help me figure out how can I figure this out? I think I am probably going to let my dad's house go, but I can't get any numbers-only from the property manager (also a realtor) whom I don't trust. People keep telling me I should keep it and rent it, but they don't know anything...his mortgage is so large and the homeowners association fees high enough that I would lose at least $400 a month by renting it. Why would anyone go through the hassle of renting a property just so that they could lose money?

I have been thinking that I would pay the mortgage as long as I am actually living in his house, and then just pay the association fees and utilities for a few months ofter that, or as long as I am basically using his house as a storage place to sort out whatever I don't initially take with me after I replace my carpeting and move back in my house. But maybe I should just stop. I don't know what to do. I was thinking about paying to replace the carpeting, along with mine but I think I am just used to doing things in tandem with him. Both houses need new hot water heaters and both need new carpeting. But I think maybe I don't need to buy new carpeting and a hot water heater for his house if I'm going to let it foreclose. It seems kinda dumb.

I just don't know what to do. I have been thinking that I should go to the bank-like tomorrow or Monday- and pay his mortgage before I go to Hawaii so I don't get a late fee. But his mortgage is almost $1500, which would pay for 100 hours of help from my moving/packing/sorting helpers. My dad did leave some money but not that much-I don't want to just throw away (to the bank). How do I figure out when to stop paying the mortgage if I am probably going to let it go. Everybody has an opinion and a lot of them are rather emphatic about their opinions, regardless how absurd. I don't know how many people have told me, "Oh you shouldn't let it go to foreclosure because it's so hard on your credit rating." Uh, well, it was my dad's mortgage and I don't think he's really concerned about his credit rating since he's dead, and I'm not sure what that would do to me because my name is not on it. Also lots of people have told me that I should sell it no matter what. So if it's worth about the same as, or less than what is owed on the mortgage, that means that I would have to cough up $10-$20K to sell it. Why would I throw away that much money? I also had someone at the bank tell me that they would foreclose on it anyway because my dad died, even if I was making payments on it and living in it, and I really needed to refinance it with myself and/or me and my sisters on the loan. That's not possible. They just want their money and I want out as soon as I can get my stuff out. I just don't know how long it will take and how long it will take to foreclose if I stop making payments. I'm having trouble getting a realtor to help me figure this out-probably because they don't think it looks like it's going to be a real sale (with income for them).

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I agree with Marty.  There are two problems with letting a house go back (you only do it when there is no other option).  1)  They're going to take whatever funds are available in the estate unless you file bankruptcy on his behalf, and then they'll still take assets.  2)  You have to pay income taxes on whatever the bank says they lost on it.  Oftentimes the bank doesn't put forth the effort (they aren't in the real estate business and it's more a hassle for them) to get what they can out of it, so you might have to pay a LOT on taxes, and it's due this year. That's why I didn't let mine go back when I lost my job, it was up side down and no way could I pay the taxes on it.  I figure I have to stay long enough to pay it off and if I can't, medically, then at least get it paid way down so that I don't end up in an up side down state.  Meanwhile I'm soaking money into it for repairs and will be for a number of years, so it's getting harder to have it become of any value monetarily.

If a person does decide to let a home go back, I'd consult an estate attorney or one specializing in tax law before making such an important decision.

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Does that mean I should keep making the mortgage payments and keep hustling? The mortgage is in his name and his Living Trust (I am the trustee) owns the house.  I do have an attorney, Linda,  who specializes in wills, trusts, estates, etc. She is also a pal of my accountant. I haven't talked to her for a few months. When I talked to Linda about the house a month or so after my dad died, she told me it was much too soon to be worried about that, so I have been just keeping things going. Maybe she knows who could help me determent the value and what to do, rather than asking friend/acquaintances who happen to be realtors. Maybe I need to talk to Linda again... Should I keep making the payments for now?

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If you have friends that are realtors they should be able to determine the value, that's what they're in business for.  I would keep the mortgage payments up, pay out of the estate,, whatever you pay out will be recovered when it sells.  Otherwise they'll tack on late fees, may change terms when it goes into default, you'd have to check the mortgage agreement to see the terms or contact the lending institution.  I would let them know he's passed though.

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Laura, for what it's worth, I think these matters are far too complicated and far too important for you to be seeking advice from friends and acquaintances, and (with all due respect) even from those of us on this site. You need to work with someone who has expertise in these specific matters. Since you are the trustee of your dad's Living Trust, you are legally liable for whatever decisions are made, right? So if I were you, I'd want to make very, very sure that any decision I make is based on the best legal advice I could get.

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I got my information directly from the IRS site, there's a lot of information there.

1099-C (Cancellation of debt)
https://www.irs.gov/uac/home-foreclosure-and-debt-cancellation

My home was up side down so had I let it go back to the bank, I would have had to pay taxes on the cancellation of debt.

When you file bankruptcy it's excluded, but they use the assets to pay down the debts.

At no point did I advise you what to do, but gave you points to consider.  I have had friends that let their homes go back to the bank and then were surprised when they got a 1099-C in the mail and found out when they filed taxes that they would have to pay income tax on the cancelled debt.  The banks hadn't done their level best to sell the homes at fair market value and they were now stuck setting up a repayment plan to the IRS, with interest and in some cases fees.  I just really don't want to see anyone else get caught by surprise.  In two of these instances, they were retired folks with small fixed incomes.  They can't even afford internet now.

I would, as I suggested above, see an estate attorney or one specializing in tax law, as I stated originally.

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Kay and Marty, thank you so much for your suggestions-I really appreciate it. Sometimes I become so overwhelmed with things I cannot see the obvious thing right in front of me. Kay, I did ask you and Marty for your advice and what I did with your advice was to put in a call to the estate attorney and decide to keep making payments until she gives me some good legal advice. And she will. My dad, who was an attorney, used to like to say that advice was what you paid for it (especially if it was free). I am not as cynical as my dad and have often found that frequently friends and acquaintances can point out things that are obvious to them but not to me. Or maybe it's just something I know nothing about. So I ask people that I think have good sense what they think, and then use my filter...

The estate attorney can figure it out. We talked about it initially and she talked to my accountant and told me, like you said that it might be a tax issue. When my dad first died, I was under the impression that his condo was about $100K under water and they explained to me loan forgiveness on that would result in the living trust having to pay taxes on income in the amount of $100K. As it turns out, I think the condo is actually worth about what it is remaining on the mortgage. I have been told that it's worth more, but I don't know... I guess I'll just keep paying on the mortgage, paying the utilities and keep exploring.

I don't know, last night I panicked about the mortgage and the condo and had this idea I had to figure it out right away, which is not true. Here's a story about my psychological history. When I was about five, I almost drowned in a pool. My mother was sunbathing in a lounge chair and my older sister and I were playing on the steps with a couple of other kids. My sister was only two years older but significantly taller and was able to stand on the pool bottom with her head above water, but not me.  I didn't know how to swim,  but was on the steps. At some point, I got jostled and was pushed off the steps to where it was over my head. I was totally under the water and reached out for my sister to save me from drowning, but she just stepped back-away from me. (Sounds like my sister, huh?) So I started jumping up and down, to go backwards until I hit the steps, and then sat there for awhile on the top step. I remember looking over at my mother who was oblivious to it all. We were all given swimming lessons the next summer, and so then we were good in the water.

It's funny, my friend Bonita had a similar experience and learned to be afraid of the water. I learned that I could save myself from drowning or anything else, but that I had to save myself because no one would ever help me. I probably got the same lesson in other settings. I have been working on learning to ask for help and accept it graciously. I think it's hard for a lot of caregivers and people in the helping/healing professions. I always think it's a marvel when people help me in any way.

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That was a good lesson that you recalled.  You are a very capable intelligent person.  Sometimes, however, when we're overwhelmed in our circumstances, the obvious is not at all...that is when we need another to point it out to us.  I think they had loan forgiveness during the recession that they exempted but that has been over a couple of years now...I did not take advantage of it preferring instead to continue plugging away as I have been because of my personal beliefs, my value system, about bankruptcy.  I am not against bankruptcy when it cannot be avoided...for instance when my sister had her accident and became quadriplegic and could no longer work (her speech was affected too), she had a ton of medical bills she could not pay, she had to file bankruptcy.  My mother, as her guardian, filed on her behalf, Donna wasn't even aware of what was going on at the time.  But as long as I am able, I want to continue paying back the lending institutions that I have borrowed from, because they trusted me enough to give me a loan.  If I became incapacitated it'd be different.  When you're dealing with an estate of someone who died, that is also different.  They no longer draw an income and can't pay their bills anymore.  

You were quiet today...were you making headway on sorting?  Just think, in one more week!!! :D  I will be happy with you!

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I was very busy working on my house with Bonita and Greg. Thanks for asking. That's really sad about your sister-how is she now?

Also today I went to the chiropractor-Ijust posted about that under the Falling topic. Say, do you think I can drink wine? No one has said anything to me about alcohol after a concussion. Everyone has asked me if I was wearing a seatbelt, but no one has said anything about alcohol after the fact...

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My sister, the same.  She was 25 when it happened, now she's 73.  She lives with a foster family, she likes the setting.  She does NOT want to be in a nursing home!  She likes being part of a family and here she's included.  The 8 year old granddaughter bought her some nail polish for her birthday and did her nails for her.  I can't tell you what that meant to her!  And the lady that takes care of her cuts her hair and dyes it and styles it, makes her feel like a million bucks!  We couldn't ask for a better home for her to be in, it was an answer to prayer.  

I just googled drinking alcohol following a concussion and they say not to.  Except one place said have water and food first.  I guess I wouldn't unless you get the go ahead from your doctor.

Of the different places I read, this one, albeit older, seems most comprehensive:

http://ohiovalley.org/informationeducation/substanceuseinformation/substanceuseeffects/

 

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Dang! I texted my friend who is a psychiatrist and she said she wouldn't recommend wine-or even tequila, but that I should ask the chiropractor. Nice timing. It's Friday night! He won't be around until next week!

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Uh huh...I think I'd refrain.  It can inhibit recovery among other things.

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Maybe I would feel better if I ate dinner-it's almost 8:30. That is Lena's advice, same as she always says to me, "Just feed the cat and everyone will feel better! Oh, and you might as well eat as well, while you are feeding the cat!" This is what she says to me...

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My dog knows at 4:45 it's time to start getting his ready (I cook his and have to mix in the supplements) so he can eat at 5:00 sharp!  THEN I think about what I'm going to eat. :)

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I feed Lena at exactly the same time as I begin eating, and it always kept her interest while my dad and I were eating. Also, we filled the two chairs at the table. Now that my dad is gone, if I feed her while I am making dinner she wants another dinner 10 or 15 minutes later when I am eating and will get up in the other chair and use it to try to get on the table to help herself to some of whatever I'm having.

It's raining!!! This is so exciting. We never get rain this early in the summer...the monsoons typically start about July 4. I opened up the doors to just the screens so I could listen to it rain. I think I can hear the flowers singing...

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It's raining here too.  I'd rather we have anything than the heat wave we had for the last week plus.

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Here too, what state are you in?

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Arizona...I live in Sedona. I used to live in Flagstaff, where it is cool and snows a lot, and then I lived in Tucson, which was too big and hot and dirty and full of crime, but now I am in Sedona, which has a temperate climate. Are you in the part of Oregon that gets a lot of rain, or no...?

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