Trey

Dear GATAF, First I'd like to express my condolences to your bf, and my sympathies for your situation. I was there a months back myself, and I know that it is not easy to navigate such turbid waters. I wanted to comment on what you said here. I hope you proceed with caution, I felt the same way in the sense that I felt that I'd be failing both myself and my ex if I didn't give it my all to be there for her, and to preserve what we had. I thought I would never forgive myself if I didn't try and fight tooth and nail. I'll spare you the details for now, although if you're interested you should be able to find my thread not too far back, but it did not end well for me. My perception that despite my best efforts to be supportive, understanding, caring, etc. that I'd failed her, and failed to preserve us has left me bereft of the confidence and and joy I once (excessively) felt . Everyone is different and so you may not feel the same, my point is just to recommend that you tend to yourself and your own struggles first and foremost, like the saying goes "You can't pour from an empty cup". The last thing you want to do is to make him feel pressured or smothered, as counter intuitive as it may sound, your loving support may actually drive him further away. So it is my opinion that it is in both your and his best interests to take a step back, tend to yourself, and try as best as you can to manage your expectations and hopes. It's easier said than done.

Hi Generic, As someone who is only a few months removed from a similar situation, I'd strongly advise you heed the advice of KayC and Rae. I refused to do that at first, I stubbornly persisted with my hopes, checking on my ex in the background and trying to 'play all my cards right'. I wanted more than anything else for her to 'snap out' of the state that lead her to push me away, and only recently have I come to accept that it was not a state. It seems tragic events can change peoples feelings, for some it may be short term, but from what I've ready on this site, it's usually permanent. My ex also resorted to cocaine on a few occasions, and was not happy about it either. Finding something you think is real is not easy, and it's even more difficult to let it go. I refused to believe that my situation would follow the trend of the rest. That stubbornness to not give up on her and us destroyed me, and I'm still far from healed. A break up always hurts, but even more so if you, like me, feel like you were 'robbed' by fate and bad timing. As KayC and Rae tried to tell me (which I regret not taking for face value) is that the notion of 'right person, wrong time' is a fallacy. It's my first time contributing to a post other than my own, but from my recent experience, this is what I would advise. 1. Don't ignore your gut feelings, I'd thought special circumstances like this would be exceptions and I gave my ex the benefit of the doubt, now I believe that circumstances like these, when our brains refuse to see what we don't want to, are exactly why we have them. I'm sure members of the other group mean well, but remember that these situations are unique. It seems the closer you are to the person, the more likely the backlash. I would trust my gut on this. 2. You can't be there for someone who doesn't accept or want you there. This is a battle he has to fight, and one that he has opted to exclude you from. 3. Don't try to be a hero, you can't help anyone unless you look after yourself first. I was ok with being hurt so long as it meant helping someone I cared about, but I neglected myself in the process and I came off worse for it. It's hard to know what is going on in his mind, and why he has opted to behave this way. All you know is that he is. and an important last one... 4. Decisions made in an emotionally fueled instant, are usually quickly reverted. Looking back at my ex's behavior leading up to when she isolated herself from me I can now see the signs that I chose to ignore at first. If you choose to wait, that's your choice, but if this isolation from you lasts longer than a few weeks, it is my opinion that it was a thought out decision, and those tend to be long term or permanent.

I'm literally just in a state of shock... Lie to me or not, she said that my presence was still useful for her. Whether or not she had feelings, how could anyone be so rude and have a complete disregard for the well-being of another, let alone someone that was there for her in her darkest hour, when others would not be. The complete lack of respect and civility, I just can't fathom that such a person would exist. She kept repeating that it was over although I made it clear that I had no intention of changing that. I did dodge a bullet there, but its made me lose faith in humanity and in love. She once mentioned that her ex told her she belonged in a mental institute, I was quick to shoot that notion down, but maybe he was onto something...

She texted back that she didn't feel like talking anymore and that I just needed to grow up and talk to someone else. I told her talking to her was a last resort, I had tried talking to everyone, and I wouldnt be doing it if I didnt absolutely need to, that I was just afraid I'd hurt myself. She said she doesn't have time for this and that I was bothering her, and if I kept trying she'd block me. She just said bye and stopped replying after that. How could someone I gave so much to bring themselves to be like that, it doesnt seem human.

So the last couple of days were rough, and on one of them I just completely broke down like I never have before. After talking it out with some that are close to me, I decided to text her today without any hidden motive so that I can get some closure which I think would help clear my mind and allow me to the ability to improve the process of moving on. Her replies so far have been mostly civil, as have mine. She essentially said everything was just a superficial lie, that whatever feelings she said she had, and whatever assurances she gave me were out of fear of being alone, and the perceived need for someone to be there for her. She said she doesnt remember asking me if I loved her, or saying that she had feelings for me and that she must have been vulnerable when she said those things and wanted to convince herself that she could be happy again, and those words were more trying to convince herself that she did than anything else. The confusing part is that she said those things both before and after her fathers death and her break up. When I asked her why she didnt tell me how she felt when I asked, she said she couldn't bring herself to do it then, and that regardless she was in turmoil and had bigger concerns than to break it to me in a way that was convenient for me, she took the cowards way out. She said she didn't owe me a face to face, and that she didnt have any feelings for me and never did. She said she was honest when she said that she didn't want to hurt me, but with time her desire to be alone grew stronger. The replies have been civil but short, which is awful too. She asked what I expect from her, with her being in such a bad state. She said that we were too different ant that I wasnt her type of man, when I asked why she had called me 'perfect' and that we were 'perfect to each other' she said she must have lied, and again was just trying to convince her self of that and that I was someone she could be happy with. I remember the look in her eyes when she said that, it seemed so genuine... so genuine that I remember it scaring me. I can see how the times after her fathers death could have been a false reality, but there was nothing to suggest that any of the things she told me before were false. She had no reason to lie to me then, her father was still alive, and she had a stableish relationship. When she said she didn't have any feelings for me, I said that for most of the time neither did I, and that I thought only to fill the void left by her ex, all I got from that was a 'lol'. I guess I really didn't know her, but I do have more questions which she asked me to hold off on for when she can give me more consistent replies. I now regret having tried to be patient with giving her time to 'get her head straight'. But now I am feeling less like I lost 'the one' and more like I shouldn't have tried to do something exceptional for someone I only briefly knew. If I get anything of worth later on in the day from her, I'll be sure to post another update. When I was contemplating texting her, part of me wished it would go another way, but now at least I know...

The past couple weeks have been rather mixed for me. I've been spending higher quality time with friends, and have been able to put more effort into self improvement and care, which has kept me more distracted and given me a bit of a self esteem boost as well. I'm still struggling to feel joy, but as I think of it that may have been the case for a while now. I'm days away from finishing school and transitioning to work, but having moved to a new country for school/work that unfortunately means that most of my friends, who were also my support system (my family lives half way across the world) will be moving away very soon. Right now I'm missing the support my ex once offered me, and the sense of optimism/security for my transition that I once felt when I'd thought she'd be by my side for it (she's a local). I don't think about her as much these days, and have been able to let go of the hope that she will one day contact me. I can't help but feel resentful of the fact that she once said that I could always rely on her to give me the kind of support I once offered her if I'd ever needed it, and that she's no longer around now that I feel that need, it sounds selfish but its how I feel now. My moral has been hampered by the sense of anxiety that I'm having, but I'm hoping that as I make this transition I'll start to feel more secure and move on more thoroughly. I have moved around very regularly during my life, so I'm unsure why this time (although I'm not actually moving anywhere new) feels more difficult than all the previous times. Being away from school, where we met during her temporary return, could help eliminate memory triggers, or so I hope. I'm wondering if I have any other underlying issues that have been brought to surface by all of this? I'm starting to realize that I do not remember being happy all that much in the past, just when I was with my previous ex, and when I'd been so busy with school (but performing very well) that I could feel confident about my abilities and feel some sense of fulfillment, but I think being busy just distracted me and I wasn't actually all that happy. I just needed some place to vent I suppose, it's funny how different life feels now...

Thanks again Rae :) She has always been a complicated girl, something she admits to, but said she'd try to work through to be with me (said before and after her fathers death on a few occasions). My feelings for her were not as strong before her fathers death, but as I spent time caring for her and meeting her mother and friends and becoming generally more central in her life my feelings began to grow. When I first decided to try and be part of her support system I had no intention of developing feelings or growing attached, but I did none the less. I'm not without my flaws either obviously, despite having good relationships in the past I can't say I've ever felt in love, which is something I knew but wanted to change. From where I am now, it feels like I've missed out on the first person I could fall in love with, but that's not her fault (or responsibility) and its no reason to drag myself through what I'm going through now. I hope I find someone I can feel for like that, and by quite the coincidence (to your last message) I was thinking just after I'd written my last post about how I have to regain my sense of self and confidence before something like that can happen. Sometimes I think I'll never find someone as great, but I need to take a step back and realize that I'm pretty great myself :) I don't know if it was co-dependency, she never asked for my help after her fathers death (although I was one of the first she broke the news to). In fact she had said she was quite surprised by me taking such a big role in supporting her, and was pleasantly surprised by how I knew the right things to do and say despite our brief history. She said she never expected me to have such a big role in her life, but was grateful for it. Maybe these events have helped me discover new things about myself that I need to work on, I used to walk around like I was invincible before (part of the reason she said she fell for me was my confidence and stature). This time apart, or more likely separation, should help me grow as a person, but I won't lie either and say that I don't wish she was someone I could grow with. But that's gone now, and dwelling on it, as hard as it is not to, will do me no good. You're right, if she ever does come back, and I feel I still care for her, then I'll have a decision to make as to whether I think I'm strong enough to help her through any mental work she needs, that is if she's willing to work on herself. I knew that there was a big chance that I would be hurt by her during her bereavement, but as I said before I felt like I was on top of the world before, and thought I could handle a little pain and that I should put that to good use by being there for someone who needed it. Boy was I wrong! I'm grateful for your reply's and care Rae, I've tried to open up to friends, but that hasn't been as helpful unfortunately.

Thank you both for putting in so much effort with me, and others on this forum like me, we'd all truly be lost without someone to guide us, because as much as we'd like to be, we're not and our stories are not completely unique. There are still several things that linger in my mind (and quite often do more than just linger). For one, I felt she was always honest with me, she told me nearly everything whether it was something I wanted to hear or not. She had told me in the early days that she had reached out to her ex for support, which was not ideal from my position, but I was focused on not controlling how she behaved in order to allow her the freedom to do as she pleased to process her grief. At times when I felt her push me away slightly, I would tell her that I know that our relationship was still really new and unfamiliar, and if she wanted me gone that she just needed to say so, she would always react as if that was unthinkable, and that I had no idea how much I helped her get through (she would sometimes speak to me whenever dark or suicidal thoughts came to her mind). When she told me she was not at a place where she could consider us a couple, she said she would be honest with me about whether in the future we could resume, or convert to being just friends. When I offered her her space then, again she said she never wanted to lose me, and cared too much for me, and with time we would figure out our dynamic. There were days where she would urge me to come visit her (I was actively trying not to be pushy), ans say all she wanted was to be in my arms. The last days we spent together were good too, she laughed and talked like she hadn't done since her father died. The last night I saw her, I again felt some distance, I live near school (a place she has very bad memories of) and at one point of the night looking out the window made her break down. She told me that she felt she could never come back because of the associated memories, but 'reassured me' that it was only a temporary decision. I began to ask the question again before we slept that night, and she cut me off, telling me not to even think that something like that would help her. She held me tighter that night than she had in a while. The next morning she began making plans with me to come over, and try a new drink she had been gifted, But a few days later is where it all disappeared, in our phone call she mentioned that it would have been better if she told me that night. I felt it, and I asked her, why did she not tell me then! I miss our friendship more than anything else, she told me that in the weeks following her fathers death that she pushed some of her closest friends away, and even considered cutting them out, but decided against it after some time. When I'm weak I think about that, and how maybe just maybe that its my turn to be 'temporarily' pushed away. I have no clue what she is up to at the moment, when I did check her social media is was just to see her last active time, and let me know she hasn't hurt herself. I've haven't done that in the past few days. I understand that it's a character flaw of hers, but we all have flaws. I do need someone more reliable for me, but for the moment it's hard to keep her out of my mind. I'm sorry, it feels like I keep going back to square 1. I really appreciate reading your thoughts, and when my mind feels like its overloaded, it helps to write about mine, I feel writing here and coming back here gives me the distraction/strength to keep from checking on her or writing to her, especially when I'm feeling weakest. I've decided not to reach out to her, not for a long while at least, she needs it, and I do too. I need to move on with my life, but I'm sure you know as well as anyone that moving on without the person you want most in your life is not exactly an easy task. At times thinking that I managed to help her get past the early stages gives me some sense of comfort, that I had a positive impression on her life, and makes me think I'm ok with us parting ways to continue our own lives. That feeling seldom lasts however. Thank you for taking the time to read my thoughts, and help by sharing your experience, it helps to communicate with someone who has been where I am, and I hope that when I finally have moved on, I can come back and be that person for others who will undoubtedly look for help here. (sorry I had no intention of writing this much when I first logged on)

It's true what you say, my head is mired in 'what if's' and thoughts of that sort. Every time I feel my confidence and strength coming back a thought will manifest its self that takes me back to square one. I'm stuck in a place where I consciously know everything you and KayC are saying is true, that I need to move on and let her be, but the thought of never seeing her again for whatever reason scares me, to the point of panic at times. The months before her fathers death were almost cinematically perfect, it's hard to believe the reality of what was and what is now. I keep finding myself making excuses for her (I still don't think I would've lost her if the timing was different) and I'm not sure how to stop. It just seems too cruel to be real.

You're right, I will let her be. I admit I should be focusing on her less, and more on myself. I'm still young and this was my fourth relationship, but the only one where I felt I could fall in love and have a future with my partner. I hope to shift my attention from now on away from her, but deleting her would effectively eliminate any chance of us ever crossing paths again, whether that's a month or years from now. I hope in the future I can come back here with good news of a reconciliation, but she means too much to me to delete her existence. KayC your advice is probably the smart way to go, but I don't think I could ever forgive myself if I did not at least try and play my cards right and hope that it works. Following my heart is bound to hurt, but it's a risk I want to take, there's a sports quote that goes something along the lines of "you're already hurt, don't quit, get your reward for it", I knew that I had set myself up to be hurt when I first decided to part of her support system (although my feeling grew with time which made it hurt worse than I'd expected), and who knows maybe one day I'll get "my reward". Either way I'll post an update when I feel one is relevant, I might be in this for the long haul although I hope to get some form of an answer sooner than later. I won't shut myself off from the idea of meeting someone new, but if down the line I still think of this girl as 'the one that got away' I'd like to have the option of contacting her.

Thanks again for your words KayC. I understand that it's in my best interest to move on, because having spent the some time reading most posts on this forum it's becoming more and more clear that there really is not much hope of her coming back. That hasn't kept me from desperately hoping that I'll be an exception, one of the last things she'd told me was that she could never forget how much I helped her despite knowing each other only briefly. It seems I still haven't managed to come to terms with things really. On another note I have, unwisely, been checking up on her social media activity every so often, which has left me concerned. She was supposed to be on a trip with a friend right now, which it seems she cancelled, and now goes days without making a presence on her messenger. This is really unlike her. She has always been a very social person, even in the months after her fathers death, and the only time I've seen her go longer than an hour without her phone were on our date nights. Maybe this is a normal stage of her grief, but I am concerned none the less. I'm torn between my heart telling me that I should check up on her knowing this is unusual behavior, and my brain doubting that it would do either of us any good and thinking that it would just further crowd her and deteriorate the already slim chance of any possible reconciliation in the future (thought being that I still sense our last encounter would not be the last, and that some point down the line she will reach out to me again). I have thought about sending her flowers or something of that sort, just as a means of very indirect contact, something that may bring a smile to her face if she is in a dark place, but again I don't know if she would be appreciative of it. I have still not contacted her, nor she me, since our brief texts about 3 weeks ago. Any advice would be welcome, I know it's unwise on my part to make emotionally fueled decisions, but I still care for this girl and know that what she is going through is 1000 times worse than anything I'm experiencing. Any advice would be welcome. Something I hadn't mentioned earlier is that about a month or so before she'd broken off contact with me, she had told me that she's not in a place where she could consider us a couple, but still had feelings for me was afraid to lose me and our friendship. Before her fathers death, she mentioned that she thought we were made for each other, and that we were perfect for each other. Those words still haunt me, because I thought that too, and I dream that with time she will remember me, and those thoughts would resurface. I dream that by allowing her space that I don't ruin the possibility of those thoughts reentering her head, but it pains me to see how negativity things seems to turn out in the experience of others. I can't help but feel that this is a case of 'right person, wrong time'.

KayC, you really are a saint to personally go through and reply to everyone's messages. There have been days since I last posted where I have felt at peace with her doing what she needed to do and what was best for her, but most days have been filled with mixed emotions. I have been pretty good about not following her social media presence, and I haven't texted here at all since (so it was just the two days where we very briefly spoke at the beginning, each a week apart). I saw in other posts that you had mentioned that you had only seen one case where things ended up working out, I was wondering if you could add the link that that post? There have been some posts that have given me comfort, and I feel like reading that post could give me some of the closure that I'm otherwise missing. Looking back to the month before we had THAT phone call, I've been picking up on different pieces which should have been a clearer warning sign I suppose. There were a few times during that month where she had told me that it was not fair for me to wait for her, and that if I felt that things weren't enough for me that I was free to pursue other girls, and that all she asked was for me to be transparent with her. There were nights where I'd go out with friends and she'd ask me if I had hooked up with anyone, it started to feel like she was hoping that I would find someone else???? I remember mostly telling her that I had no interest in finding anyone else, and my only focus at the moment was on helping her however she needed. Maybe someone can help me clarify this a bit better? It seems like she wanted me gone (although I told her, several times actually, that I knew things were hard for her, and that if she got the feeling that she needed me gone for whatever reason that all I asked was for her to be honest with me, she always very quickly shot me down when I said that, even on that night a couple days before our phone call, and then was cold when she actually did it). She broke up with her ex-boyfriend, partly because of me, and I feel like with the loss of her father her thoughts kept reverting back to the other person she recently lost, but one that was not permanently gone. Does she resent me for the role that I played in her breaking up with her ex?? I don't think either of her parents or her friends ever really got along with him, but he was the person she had stayed with the longest amount of time in her life. To wrap things up, I've been remembering the days before her fathers death where she would tell me that she felt we had a passion for each other, and that she thought that I was perfect. She even let it slip that she loved me once, and that was after less than a month of being together. Also one day asked us what our hypothetical wedding would look like since we came from different cultures and backgrounds. I also remember a few days after her fathers death where I put in big efforts to surprise her or make her happy, and succeeded. On those days (and others) she said she looks forward to a future where she could make me happy as well. I'm still fairly confused, part of me tells me that she was genuine when she told me all those things, and that maybe just maybe one day in the future she would want to give us a real chance again. Other parts tell me that a girl like her could have anyone she wanted, and that regardless of how she felt about me or what she thought of me, that she wouldn't pick to be with someone that reminds her of this past. It's heartbreaking to think that we could be a case of 'right person, wrong time'.

I'll try and be concise but give a backstory in case that makes a difference. I met a girl in Months ago and knew we had a liking to each other from day 1. Fast forward a week or two and we'd begun to interact and I asked her out, to which she said yes. At that time her father already had terminal cancer, and she knew it was just a matter of time before he passes. She'd had a boyfriend when we had met, but broke up with him after we'd been seeing each other a few weeks (she'd also often mentioned how insensitive he was of her situation, and how he offered her little to know support. So we'd begun dating, and for about a month everything was good, she'd even hinted she was in love. Then her dad passed away after his condition rapidly deteriorated. I was one of the first person she broke the news to over text, I replied telling here that I was there whenever she needed me, but felt that on that day she needed to be with family. Although we were very new, I made the decision to stick by her and offer her any kind of solace and relief I could. The next day I visited her and her mother, and brought them a few supplies I thought they'd need, to which they seemed grateful. Over the next weeks I essentially dropped everything in my life to be there for her, which was something bother she and her mother noticed, and they constantly thanked me for my efforts. It seemed that I was able to provide her with some comfort, and I was happy to do that for her. What I later found out however, was that she had reached out to her ex-boyfriend in search for his support, which he refused to give her. I also periodically found out that she was blocking him and unblocking him, switching between asking for his support, and insulting him for being so inhumanely insensitive. I still stuck by her because I knew how difficult a time it was for her, and I tried to ignore that, and do anything I could to support her and give her moments of happiness (which again she repeatedly thanked me for). A few weeks after her fathers death, she went away for a vacation to change scenery for a couple week, here is where she'd first mentioned that she could not consider us a couple at the time, but would be honest with whether we were best suited to be friend or lovers in the future. It hurt, but again I accepted it and tried to check up on her and comfort her daily. While there she did continue to text me when she was feeling depressed, and I would always do my best to comfort her (she then told me how much I meant to her and how she would never want to lose me, and that she would always be there for me like I was for her, but also that I shouldn't feel obliged to stick by her, and that if I met someone else it would be ok). Fast forward about a month and a half after her fathers death and things seemed to be getting better for her, and we starting spending more time enjoying each others company. Throughout this time, I had mentioned to her several times that if she felt that she needed more time or to take a break from me that it was ok, I wanted what was best for her and that I only asked for her honesty (she said that was definitely not the case). A couple weeks after that, she had come over to my place, for only the second or third time since her father passed, she was speaking about her ex again, only this time she kept referring to him as her boyfriend (freudian slip), we had just spend a good weekend together (and she thanked me for making her laugh again then) and that evening its self overall was better than average. I began to ask her that night what I'd asked before, and she cut me off saying she still wanted me in her life. I made the mistake the next day of telling her that I was hurt by how she kept speaking with her ex and it seemed she still loved him, she said she did... We didn't speak for a couple days after that, then I initiated contact as per usual, but things seemed off and cold. I asked her if we were ok, she said she didn't know and that we would talk the next day. I called her the next day, she told me that she felt that I wanted her to be my girlfriend but that she wasn't ready for that, and still thought about her ex. She said she needed time to focus on herself and that we could still remain close, but only gave me a 10 minute call. I wanted to respect that so I didn't contact her, and she didn't contact me, for a week. I texted her again to see if she was ok and if we could meet (and noticed she'd begun delaying her replys to my messages). she accepted, but said she couldn't that day (and I was away the next week) but things felt cold now. She also said that she was feeling much much better. I texted her again when I returned, asking when she felt comfortable to meet, again after delaying her reply (for half the day) she said she couldn't now and that she was busy. I told her I didn't understand her sudden coldness to me, and that if she wanted me out of her life that it was ok, and I just wanted some closure. She didn't acknowledge any of those comments, and simply replied (maybe next week). It's been over two weeks now since we had that phone call, and I'm just hurt and confused. She said repeatedly that I meant alot to her, and how valuable my support had been to her before and after her father's death. I changed myself for her so I could be as supportive as possible (if at all relevant, when we'd met she was infatuated with me, as I was considered by many as the most desirable guy on campus, and someone who very confident and admired, for her I changed to be more sensitive, and down to earth, neglecting my friend and responsibilities as a result). I'm just so confused, how could she just cut me off like that after everything she said to me? is it because I changed and she was no longer attracted to this new person, is it her grief, her ex? I'm sorry if this is not appropriate, but I consulted this site before when I was trying to learn how to be a good support system for her, and it seemed a good place to turn to. I know our relationship was short before, but I'd never made myself so vulnerable for someone before, and I resent the fact that I feel taken advantage of.