Mmeories - Good Or Bad?

[WaltC]

MEMORIES - Good or Bad?

Today’s message from Martha Hickman’s Healing After Loss once again offers some hope for anyone in the “early” stages of grief. (Early will mean different times for each of us – for me it’s almost a year - for others it may be even longer.)

While the memories of our loss may still be quite painful and bring tears to our eyes, there is some hope that memories will be something to cherish not fear.

Martha writes:

“…after a time, a long time, we may welcome the association as a poignant reminder of happy times shared and not to be forgotten…..

Healing moves at its own pace. What is a burden one day may be a gift another day.”

I am so glad that I found this great little book! And I am also grateful that I found this site and cyber-met so many wonderful people who understand this journey.

As the song says - let’s weep not for memories for they are memories of happiness and love.

Memories

Edited March 22, 2006 by WaltC

[kayc]

Walt,

Thank heavens, no one can take our memories away from us. We may have lost contact with our loved one temporarily, but our love and our memories are forever. What we had, still is, and always will be.

[WaltC]

Walt,

Thank heavens, no one can take our memories away from us. We may have lost contact with our loved one temporarily, but our love and our memories are forever. What we had, still is, and always will be.

Kay

Yes, I totally agree with you and emphasize the temporary aspect of the loss. I promised Jeannie that I would try to survive for a year - that year is almost up.

[kayc]

Walt,

It's hard to believe it's been a year for you...you have survived much and the very worst, the shock, the adjustments, that's behind you...now you just have to hang in there and survive some more...until it's your time to join her. You can make it! You may have times you don't want to or see the point, but your family and friends want you still and you have purpose here or you'd have been able to join her already. Part of that purpose has been fulfilled in your postings on this site, as you have been a friend and an encouragement to us all. But your time WILL come to be reunited with your little Jeannie! I like how you call her your little Jeannie...my George always called me his Little One. How precious is that love!

[spela]

Walt (and others),

you might remember that I wrote recently how depressed I was. How I didn't have any energy and I felt so very bitter ... I knew I couldn't do this for a long time, not like that ... well, 3 days ago something changed inside me. I donpt know what happened, but I decided to come back to life. To do something about it. By myself, not wait for my friends to come to me. Does anybody of you know Louise Hay's book Heal Your Life? I highly recommend it. It helped me a lot when Janez was ill, to find the strenght in me. Later I thought I would never open it again because after he died, DESPITE all the faith, everything seemed like a big lye. Now I've opened it again and read this affirmation "It is safe to feel. I am open to life. I have desire to live" (I used my own words here). I know I will always miss him, I know I will always love him and I will continue to dream of what it could be "if only" ... But I will live. With my love for him. With the memories, which now don't only make me cry but also make me smile or sometimes laugh ...

There is hope. I can't explain what happened, maybe I was so tired of feeling so low. Maybe someone said exactly what I needed to hear. Now I do want to live. I can do that, and you can do that too.

[WaltC]

... well, 3 days ago something changed inside me. I don't know what happened, but I decided to come back to life. To do something about it. By myself, not wait for my friends to come to me. Does anybody of you know Louise Hay's book Heal Your Life? I highly recommend it. It helped me a lot when Janez was ill, to find the strength in me.... Now I do want to live. I can do that, and you can do that too.

Spela - I am truly happy that you have found the determination to live and are making some progress. That's great!

For others here's a link for more information on that book:

You Can Heal Your Life

My problem is that I don't want to live any longer without Jeannie. I have tried for almost a year and there does not seem to be any improvement. I promise her that I would hang in for one year, but I guess that it really is true that you can't teach an old dog new tricks.

[Guest Guest]

Spela - I am truly happy that you have found the determination to live and are making some progress. That's great!

For others here's a link for more information on that book:

You Can Heal Your Life

My problem is that I don't want to live any longer without Jeannie. I have tried for almost a year and there does not seem to be any improvement. I promise her that I would hang in for one year, but I guess that it really is true that you can't teach an old dog new tricks.

[Guest Guest_Vivian_*]

Walt: Whenever you write I think of my mother's cousin, Jeannie. She lost her husband, Walt, a few years back and like you and your Jeannie were, I believe,

very much in love.

Today my sister in law, my daughter and I took Rick's mother out to celebrate her 88th birthday. I'd like to think that Rick was looking down on us seeing all his 'closest girls'. I made sure to bring up Rick's name and his sister and I recalled funny stories. By telling and retelling these stories I believe we keep our loved ones close to our hearts always.

[spela]

WaltC, I felt like that for a long time, more than a year, and I lost the hope that it could ever be easier and that I would ever want to live again. So I know what you're talking about. But now I do want to live - I can't explain what happened, it just did. It won't be the same life, but I have chosen to live, with my love for him.

So, WaltC, there IS hope for you. You CAN make it.

As about teaching the old dog new tricks - hey that't not true at all!! You would be amazed if you saw all the things you CAN teach a dog, no matter his/her age, the only thing is that you need a little more patience AT THE BEGINNING, then it becomes much easier! (I amd talking from an experience with dogs, but I'm quite sure it's not much different with people!)

[MartyT]

My dear Walt,

Last Wednesday you said, "I promised Jeannie that I would try to survive for a year - that year is almost up."

On Friday, you told us that "My problem is that I don't want to live any longer without Jeannie. I have tried for almost a year and there does not seem to be any improvement."

I wonder if you realize, Walt, what a valuable member you have been to the people on this site? Do you know that you have left an important and helpful message in this forum on the average of every other day (150 posts to date) for the last eleven months? In the course of your time here with us, you have discovered and provided links to six other very helpful sites, four excellent books, and 33 beautiful and comforting songs. You have shared with us over two dozen inspiring poems. I know, because I went through every single one of your posts today, and I added them up!

Here is a sample of your own wisdom that you've acquired along your own grief journey, which you've been generous enough to share with others:

Walt's Wisdom

June 22, 2005: It is truly helpful to have a friend on this journey . . . all we can do is take one day/step at a time and hopefully accommodate (not "get over") our loss.

June 25: I don't pretend to be a poet - but it helps a little to write of my loss.

July 2: (To ustwo) You have an absolute right to feel such pain and any other emotion. Don't let anyone try to deprive you of that right. You also don't have to be strong regardless of what well meaning others may tell you . . . You will never "get over" this grief, but hopefully you will come to accomodate it in time. The amount of time varies for us all. It's been 11 weeks for me and I still don't see any end in sight. But, like you I take life one day at a time. There's nothing else that we can do. As long as we are alive there is some hope for us.

(To another member who is a nurse) I am glad to know that you have come to terms with his death, but I understand that doesn't take away the pain. Half of your life is gone and it will take some time to accommodate such a significant loss. Life will move forward and the fact that we live on means there is hope that we can find some purpose in life. The fact that you are a nurse tells me that you do have a noble purpose and can bring comfort to others. In fact, now that you are experiencing such a deep personal loss, you will be able to be even more understanding of the needs of the spouses of your patients. I realize that you would much prefer not to have this painful experience, but it will help you I am sure. There is no need to feel bad or weak or abnormal if we still feel the pain of our loss when others feel we should “get over it”. There is “no need to apologize if after many months we are still finding grief a major pre-occupation.” And there is nothing to be ashamed of if a special memory of our loved one reduces us to tears a very long time after our loss. My daughter has been a great comfort to me in these devastating times. It's good to be able to cry and have someone understand your grief.

July 3: Jean and I used to discuss this point [that] she wants me to be "happy" after her death, but I told her I could NEVER be happy without her but would "carry on" for the children's sake . . . Like you, I will also go on, mainly because Jean wants me to. Death has parted us physically but will not take her presence away from me.

July 9: All we can do is take one moment at a time . . . remember your loved one who has physically left would want us to carry on until we can meet again.

July 12: I agree with you that time will never take away this pain that we suffer. I don't expect it to leave ever, but somehow we have to deal with it - that's what our partners want.

August 4: I realize that we will all take a different length of time to accommodate our loss and move on to a more positive outlook that our spouses would want us to do. I have been told by others that until I want to move on I will never be able to do so. My background training in Psychology and my career in management training and Personnel (HR) work tells me that is true . . . there is a small percentage of grievers who don't try to move forward. If they don't try, then they, like me, are doomed to a life of misery.

August 13: Quoting from Healing after Loss, "If I cannot believe it now, I can hold out hope that in time my lost love will be a continuing blessed presence in my life."

September 1: I only hope that I can learn to accept what Jeannie would want

September 11: Sometimes by helping others with their grief and loneliness we can also get some relief for ourselves.

September 17: Hang on - it's a tough road that we are on together with some very rough spots. There are others here who have survived, but there will be regressions.

September 18: Without this great site and people like yourself, ustwo, spela and others I wonder if I would have survived as long as I have since my dearest Jean died. Monday will be our 41st wedding anniversary and I just don't know how I will get by that day - but I know that I will because of the support that I get here.

September 23: I have accepted the fact that she is no longer physically present. But she still lives in my heart and mind and always will. Does this mean that I will never be "happy" again? Probably, but I have Jeannie for company and good friends here also to help me survive . . . I certainly don't want to say Goodbye to anyone here.

September 25: Since my Jeannie died I have really come to appreciate butterflies. I will miss them over the winter months. Unlike some others I just don't have the desire to move on with life. I am happy for those who can do so. I know that if I don't try I will not succeed . . .

September 27: All that keeps me "going" at all some days is reminding myself that Jeannie told me to do so. I usually do what she asks me to do and I must respect her wishes . . .

October 2: All I know from my own experience is that the more loss we feel the more grateful we should be for whoever it was we had to lose. It means we had someone worth grieving for . . . Saddened as I am by loss, my heart lifts in gratitude for the richness Jeannie has brought to my life.

October 18: We should always remember that when our spouse died part of us died too, BUT also remember that because you have survived and live on, part of your beloved spouse lives on also

October 19: Your friends here are with you in spirit today to hold your hand and give you hugs if you need them.

October 20: Gradually it does get just a little easier to survive as each day goes by.

October 22: "...when we let ourselves brood about past events or think about the future times when we shall miss our loved one so sharply, then we are in real trouble! The past - as we know only too well is over. The future is unknowable. So, as much as we are able, let's limit our concerns to this day only" That's good advice in my opinion.

October 27: All you can do is take one breath at a time, then one hour at a time, one day and then one week. I can hardly recall how I functioned at all in the first few weeks of my loss, but I did find some good support here and at other sites also.

October 28: Don't let anyone rush you to "move on" too soon. We have to go through the hard work of grief, we can't go around it. I went to the gravesite and talked with Jeannie every day for the first two months. Now it's only every other day.

October 29: I will survive with the help of caring people like yourself IF I let them help and don't turn them off with a lot of "yes, buts." I keep trying because I know that Jeannie wants me to and because of the appreciative folk here.

October 30: For myself, joining Jeannie can't happen too soon, but I will not take any action to shorten the time. I wouldn't want my Jeannie to be upset that I didn't follow her wishes. I really don't know why we were left behind, but if we can help someone else by sharing maybe that's why.

November 3: Today's reading from Martha Hickman's Healing After Loss reminded me to say Thank You to all here for sharing this journey of grief with me: "We never stop loving the one who is gone, and we will help our own healing and enhance the lives of others if, in some way, we open our arms to someone in need." Thank You so much for sharing - it does help!

November 6: There are thousands of leaves out there waiting to be raked. These leaves are mainly gold, with a few brown ones and even fewer red ones. As I began raking I thought of the gold leaves as pleasant memories of the past and the brown leaves as some of the adversaries that Jean and I overcame together. The few remaining red ones represent the bad times and sorrows that we shared . . . I forgot how many good memories I have. There are enough Gold Leaves out there to rake up and enjoy for quite a while . . . In the front yard I could cover the brown, red and black leaves with the Gold ones. I hope I can do the same with these memories.

November 9: Just by being here and sharing you have been a support for me and others . . . You make my journey less lonely and easier to bear with someone who shares and cares.

November 16: [After our site was down for a week] We don't really appreciate some things until we lose them do we? It's good to have this site back up and running so we can share our feelings with others who really care.

November 21: I am so thankful for the good and supportive friends that I have met here.

November 24: With your continuing support and understanding I will survive and hopefully be able to give similar support to others.

November 30: I really love you all and appreciate the help and comfort that you have provided. I just do not have the courage that you speak of right now, but who knows maybe Jeannie will talk to me and tell me to smarten up. She was never one to have any self-pity even though she suffered a lot in the last year of her precious life.

December 26: I never thought that I would make it this far. Certainly the wonderful folk here like Kayc and Spela and Evelyn and Charlie and John and others have been a HUGE factor in making this "life after Jean" more bearable . . . This site has been a true "life-saver" for me so I share your thoughts about everyone here who takes the time to share and comfort others in pain. Thank You for sharing and caring!

January 2, 2006: As I think back to last year when a large part of me died with the loss of my Jeannie to cancer I wonder how I have survived this long. Without a doubt the support that I have found here and other similar groups has played a BIG role in that survival.

January 7: I certainly regret that my Jeannie died last April, BUT there’s nothing I can do to change that horrible FACT. So the best that I can do is to honour her memory EVERY day for the rest of my life and NEVER forget our everlasting love for each other.

January 19: Who knows what 7 months from now will bring - we can't know that either. All we can do is take one day at a time and do our best to keep the good memories of our loved one alive. I know that it is difficult to find a purpose to continue on this journey of grief, but please know that your posts here do help others.

February 4: I'm sorry that you're hurting so desperately right now. I know how painful the seconds, and minutes, and days can be, how long the nights are. I understand how very hard hanging on is, and how much courage it takes. I ask though that you hold onto one day at a time.

February 8: The heart does go on! Love lasts for our lifetime and never stops. Someday we will be once again with our Gene and Jean. They are here with us in our hearts and that's why we can go on.

February 20: Perhaps he just doesn't want you or your daughters to see him cry. It's not easy being a father/grandfather and to be crying in front of your children - even though you know in your heart that they understand. It's still so early in his journey of grief. We all move at our own pace. Please continue to be patient and know that it will get a little easier as time goes on.

March 15: Hold On Friends - Hold On! I have found that this is one great place to visit often. The support and understanding that I have found here has helped me get thru the past 11 months . . . I agree that we have learned a lot on this journey - one trip which we would prefer not to take. While pain is indeed one constant, it is bearable because we can remember the love that we shared and which continues forever.

March 22: I am so glad that I found this great little book! And I am also grateful that I found this site and cyber-met so many wonderful people who understand this journey.

I took the time to assemble all these quotations, Walt, because I think they do show incredible growth and insight. Over the last 11 months, you have become an expert in the process of mourning, and you've shown yourself to be a sincere, caring, compassionate guide for all of us who are walking the same path with you. I know you didn't ask for any of this, Walt, and I know that if you had a choice, you would not be on this path at all. But you are here, and somehow you've managed to make the most of it, just as your beloved Jeannie wants you to do. Listen to your own words, Walt, and take them to heart. Hold on! Stay the course! Keep on keeping on. We need you here with us. What would we do without you?

Wishing you peace and healing (and butterflies),

Marty T

[WaltC]

Thank You so much Marty

To take the time and trouble to go through my posts and summarize them shows me that you are someone who really cares about the people here!

I do appreciate that a LOT and certainly will give much thought to your advice. If I have been of any help to others for the past few months that is a good thing to know. I have been wallowing a lot in self pity and do not want to burden others with my grief - especially those who have enough of their own to deal with.

This Discussion Group has been a true lifesaver for me and I have found good support and understanding here.

Goodnite for now and Thanks again.....

[ustwo]

WaltC...I wish I had the gift of "words" to help you as much as you have helped me and others as we try and find our way. You were my first connection at this site when I was unable to do anything but put my grief to type. Your "yellow roses" sit on my desktop...a beautiful gift to me and Gene...that I still go to when I am at my lowest points. Your love for Jeannie made me notice butterflies again...they all are Jeannie's butterflies in my world and I will never look at another without remembering "WaltC and Jeannie"..."LOVE IS FOREVER"

This site where we show our pain and grief does not burden anyone. We've shared here, we understand here, and we shed tears together. I have not posted much lately as I look more to the calendar as if there is some line in the sand approaching that I must cross. WaltC..let Jeannie's footsteps guide you. WE all here care in this place where we share our heartaches. You have lifed many of us up...we're here for you!

Thank you WaltC.

Always Gene!

Always!

[Charlie]

WaltC

Yes you are an inspiration to all of us. I read yours and John's posts and it keeps me sane. You always send us a song, I look forward to because the words always fit into the pain we all feel.

Don't despair, we all need you here to lighten our load and in doing that you are also helping yourself to get thru your own personal grief.

It has been almost 18 months for me and it still hurts, but this website and your posts help ease the pain.

Thank You,

Grace

Edited March 26, 2006 by Charlie

[Bebekat]

Walt,

I look foreward to reading your posts. You always find the right song to go with your post. I'm amazed. It's a form of art; a gift. You have always been there for me. I know it's very hard sometimes, but we are here for you. We need you.

[kayc]

Walt,

You have meant so much to so many of us here on this forum, I couldn't imagine it without you. We have all come to love and appreciate you.

And Marty...I can't believe you went through all of those posts and compiled that, how very sweet! Sometimes we forget that someone actually reads what we write...it's a lesson to us how much impact we can have on each other. Hang in there, Walt!

[WaltC]

I need some help interpreting a message

I attended a memorial service today with my dear MIL. The service was honoring her daughter/my wife.

One of the bible passages read was from John Chapter 12:

V25 - "Those who love their life lose it and those who hate their life in this world will keep it for eternal life."

This really puzzles/bothers me

Jeannie truly loved her life and did lose it. My comfort is that she is now free from pain and suffering and is in a "better place" of bliss.

Because I now hate my so-called life does this mean that I am doomed forever to exist in this state?

Any thoughts will help....

If this is an inappropriate post I apologize and I will ask Marty to delete it

[kayc]

Walt,

I don't think this is an inappropriate question...anything that concerns you is a legitimate question to ask. I have studied the Bible all of my life, and while I don't consider myslef a Bible scholar on any account, there are some things I have noticed.

1) The Bible passage must be taken in context. Who was speaking? (Jesus) Who was He addressing? (Andrew, Philip, some Greeks) What was happening at the time? (He was predicting His own death and was about to be killed).

2) Jesus often spoke in parables...He used illustrations to convey things. Sometimes people understood plainly what He was talking about, sometimes they didn't. He liked likening something to something else. So then you have to look at it and try to ascertain what He was likening it to, who he was really talking to (Just those there at the time? Us?)

3) What is the comparison He is making here?

4) What is the pertinance to today?

So we take a look at the verse...

Those who love their life lose it and those who hate their life in this world will keep it for eternal life.

My opinion: He was speaking to a group of people...He was about to be killed and was possibly relaying the significance of that to them. There are some things we are supposed to love more than our life...if we love our life (or ourselves) more than anything, we will end up losing it (eternally)...but when our priorities are in order, then we will be saved (eternally)...this is a pretty loose innterpretation and doesn't factor in all of the rest of theology that comes into play. But I don't think He's talking about people who enjoy life here...or don't enjoy it. I don't see anywhere where we are faulted for enjoying our lives. You also have to consider all of the other verses in the Bible to get a whole picture. One of which is..."it rains on the just and the unjust"...in other words, life just happens to us, the good and the bad, all of it...it doesn't fall necessarily fairly, it just happens. I really wouldn't worry about it, Walt. God is not going to stick you with living forever in this state just because you aren't happy and you miss your wife. He's not like that. He is caring. If He wasn't caring He wouldn't tell us to comfort those who need comforted and weep with those who weep. He is empathetic. You can be assured that you will join your little Jeannie and whether she lived or died or you live or die has nothing to do with either of your happiness with this life. Life just happens...death just happens. Rest easy.

[Guest Guest_Deborah_*]

WaltC, I join you in asking that question. I've been asking that since the day Larry died and am still asking. I've asked my friends and family to please let me go, I've asked my hospice counselor also. I'm still asking.