Always thought we had tomorrow

[Gwenivere]

I’d sure like to believe this is true.  I had always believed, despite my Catholic upbringing, that life just blipped out at death.  That was OK til it started happening to me with my mother back in 1990.  We don’t want to believe such vibrant people we love can simple cease to exist.  I don’t have any interest in a medium, but if we could truly know (the question of time immemorium), we all could have some peace in the now.

I’m glad this helped you, Jim.  I’ve heard many accounts of people getting answers or at least validating comfort from this and I never question anyone’s pursuit for that.  I want to believe in my mind that Steve exists in some way still.  I don’t feel him and really never have.  Just the usual dreams we all get and triggers from my own memory.  Lots of tech problems he would solve, but that would not be a comforting way to say he was close.  For awhile the phone would display his name calling our house when I got home from our house.  Being a former phone tech I knew it was ringback from solicitors that hung up hitting our answering machine.

not being religious, I don’t have that faith that helps many too.  I live in a new world that is just void of him.  It’s very cold and I have no idea still if we blip out or meet again or go our own ways when passing over.  My focus is so missing him now and the years that have passed.  I look at my own demise and just hope somehow it stops the physical and mental pain.  That’s all I want and if I get to see that wonderful man who gave me a great life, my mother who gave me life and all the people in between, it will be a most pleasant gift.   

[nashreed]

It's something to look forward to, at least. Right now I have nothing really to look forward to. I used to get into Facebook flame wars with my "friends" who are COVID deniers and idiots just for the interaction, but that's gotten old and there's no getting through to them.  At least my phone gives me a joke every day- that's nice. If I just had somebody say "Hey, how are you?", it would be nice. Nobody really seems to care about me in the real world.

[kayc]

21 hours ago, scba said:

Exactly! You find yourself in a platitudes' party. And that's rightly painful! they cause extra pain, which you don't need it and not from friends.

A long time friend, who even met my boyfriend (mostly didn't cause we lived abroad) she spoke about closing doors, about possible things from my bf past and his way of being with his sickness who may have caused his death. Another one dared to say that my boyfriend hidden the gravity of his illness to me, he should have prepared me for the possibility..... 

With these people in the few occasions I casually meet them I keep things as impersonal as they can be. I wish them the best but they're not part of my life anymore. 

https://www.griefhealingblog.com/2015/11/in-grief-feeling-let-down-by-closest.html
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/friendships_b_2838996
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/friendship-why-i-not-longer-hold-onto-relationships-that-no-longer-serve-me_b_8027096

Grief has a way of rewriting your address book. NONE of my friends stayed by me when my husband passed.  None!  My two best friends didn't even bother coming to his funeral!  Instead, AFTER knowing the date, they planned something "fun" to do with their husbands.  
I did make a new friend after his death, we were besties until she moved to another state ten years later.  We also went through the death of her husband.  She's remarried now, I'm very happy for them, they're doing well (it's been about five years, but I sure miss her!

A true friend is like a rare gem!

[Gwenivere]

10 hours ago, kayc said:

Grief has a way of rewriting your address book.

That is an absolute truth.  I’ve found more deletions than entries.  It’s bad enough we lose them, but so many others.  It’s so unexpected because....

10 hours ago, kayc said:

A true friend is like a rare gem!

Exactly!  I thought people I lost were friends.  Grief is like a test, I guess.  Didn't think it would be.  Thought it was another thing that happened and my friends would accept that too.  I got a few months and they decided that was enough.  It was me that created the distancing as I tired of feeling I was boring or frustrating them by not 'hurrying' this grief thing to a finale.  It’s sad and painful, but as I wisen, I see they can’t understand a situation that won’t end.  I just wish I was still as cared about with this change.  I never had to do it for another who lost a spouse, so I can’t say how I’d handle it.  Losing parents, pets I did with others and that was acceptable when it happened to me.  I can only look at myself and see this is so different and no one can understand how far reaching it is til it happens.  

So it’s a mixture of disappointment and understanding with friends.  I’ve had to adapt to being alone, but I still miss them.  Or the downgrade of leaving out parts of me when I speak to a couple.  Not used to that.  Never will be.  Have to plan what to talk about now to avoid deep grief issues.  So very odd and almost like preparing a script.

[nashreed]

It would have been nice to have had friends to begin with.

In middle school, I had a couple of really good friends. Then one day, they just stopped being my friend. I was a fairly stereotypical "nerd" in school, but not overly antisocial. I never again trusted people and never attempted to make friends after that. I was a basket case in high school. I was forced to get a job after high school... where I met Annette and she became everything to me, right then and there. I knew she was the one and I didn't need anybody else. She had friends that became my friends, until they let her down or betrayed her trust- then they were never heard from again. She was very sensitive and didn't trust people easily. If she dropped somebody, I trusted it. She was all I needed. I actually tried to repair a long friendship after she passed- a couple who are still my "friends" on Facebook, who live in the town that I had to move back to. Of course, I haven't gotten anything except cursory "sorry"'s. It might be because they live with the wifes mother who is 98 or something and are not socializing at all with anybody- I don't know.  I have a few more school friends from Facebook that I tried to establish real relationships with. After texting back and forth a few times, they flake out. Nobody has any interest in hearing my grief or dealing with somebody who has had such a loss. 

[Gwenivere]

I’m trying to ease my frustration with people that don’t understand.  Trying to see it from their side.  I don’t want to continue to be down on people that can’t understand something I never could have.  I try and focus on accepting once friends that have opted to draw boundaries on once full relationships.  I can only do so much and it’s their right to pull back.  As I said, I have no idea how I would react to others in my situation.  It’s so easy to judge if we let ourselves.  I’m grateful I have the connections here that let me be me.  Unfortunately, they don’t replace real life people we can physically see and connect with in the moment.  There’s the phone, but it’s human contact we-all crave.  I don’t do Facebook, but I have attempted reconnections with people, but they move on.  My closest connection was Steve’s sister as she was a widow herself and lost her brother.  When she died I felt really cut off from support.  I joined here and it’s been almost 7 years now.  I leave myself open to new people, but as of yet have found any that stick beyond light associations.  Best we can do.  that and add counselors that can really help, but they cant be friends. If I’m up to it, I have a Zoom meeting with a local support group to see if that helps.  I don’t know how many will be widowed or dealing with other losses like parents or children.  I know I can’t take on too much of others pain if it doesn’t relate to mine.  Sounds selfish, but we are limited in what we can handle.  My anger is my daily pain which robs me of energy I desperately need.  Nature is hard to take it out on.  Who or what do you unleash your anger on?  (Rhetorical)

[nashreed]

One of the only good things about being with my emotionally repressed family is I don't get angry and scream like I would when I was with Annette. I didn't get mad at her, I got mad at situations. I would scream and curse and have to get it out if there was a problem with her health or if somebody did her wrong (which I did not tolerate). I would get so upset if I even wrapped her leg badly (she had bad edema towards the end). She, of course, always talked me down. Now I've reverted to my former self.  I feel like screaming at the damn rotten kids that make all the noise in the evening, but I've learned to just seethe in silence- the family way (with some mumbled complaints under my breath).

[Gwenivere]

Just my opinion, but I think you need some outlets for your frustrations that are piled on your grief.  Things like kids, dogs, neighborhood noises will always be there.  I know it’s gets annoying, but we have to realize it is our fragility that intensifies them.  I’ve been following your frustrations and wish you could tune out that stuff.  It’s hard, but I had to because.....life does go on.  Since you can’t legitimately yell at your neighbors, is there someplace you can go to get it out?  My counselor told me she goes on drives to scream if needed.  I know I’ve taken drives to sob.  I’m alone, but can’t seem to cry well at home.  Saying 'damn rotten kids' says it’s inside you. That is what kids do.  We sometimes forget or are just more sensitive.  

[nashreed]

I know. You're right. Annette would say the same thing. I really have gotten better. When I first moved here, I did yell at the kids. I'm probably very upset inside that they're alive and having fun and she's not. I listen to music and do try to block it out, and it works. I do go for drives. I quite literally have nowhere to go. Of course, I can't even hang out at the mall or see a movie. Right now I'm low on gas and oil too! Hooray for me! 

[Gwenivere]

Most days I have nowhere to really go.  I just have to get out of here.  I’ll take some mail to the post office rather than put it in my box.  Maybe order something for my dog and instead of having them bring it out, go in and pick it up.  Sometimes I just pick a direction and go see what’s changed from my/our old world.  That’s always risky because so much disappears from when we were together.  It still would have, but we saw it together and could lament it.  Have seen some interesting new places I’ve scoped out alone.  I miss doing that and deciding if we’d be back or it wasn’t for us.  Being at your parents, you don’t get to go home and have a small feeling of the familiar.  Steve’s all around me in our house.  Choices we made in decor and what’s on counters for snacks, the DVR that were shared watching besides each of our interests.  Wouldn’t have big sound had he not installed it.  Point being that I get having so much time now to fill.  I still wake up disappointed every morning.  I don’t  much care for real life anymore.

[kayc]

16 hours ago, Gwenivere said:

I tired of feeling I was boring or frustrating them by not 'hurrying' this grief thing to a finale.

I could write an article about what to do, what not to do, when grieving, so as not to alienate your friends.  But who'd want them that way!  Seems to me if we have to pretend to be okay, they aren't worth our time of day, quite honestly!  And us with no energy or clarity of mind to deal with it!  These were people I had BEEN THERE FOR!  Through their divorces, and everything that went with it.  Stayed up late at night with them, listened to them, totally been there for them.  How quick they forgot!  Nope, they turned out to be "friends that were not."  (See above articles on friendships)

6 hours ago, Gwenivere said:

I don’t  much care for real life anymore.

I think this is applicable not only to grievers but everyone this year, COVID has greatly affected people not only in our nation, but all around the world as it's changed our social interaction, our daily activities, everything.

[Gwenivere]

On 12/7/2020 at 7:21 AM, kayc said:

COVID has greatly affected people not only in our nation, but all around the world as it's changed our social interaction, our daily activities, everything.

I know.  You can’t not know unless you are one of those deniers.  But even they have to acknowledge it to deny it.  

I participated in a Zoom grief support group last night.  I didn’t think I would like it and was uncomfortable at first.  There were 2 facilitators and 6 participants.   It was 90 minutes.  As I was new I gave a brief reason I was there.  As the time went on and I listened (it was for people losing partners like this forum) I heard the same pain I know from myself and everyone here.  There was a warmth about being able to see faces and interact in real time.  There were tears and smiles and lots of nods speaking of feelings.  One woman told me that while she lived with her daughter and 2 grandkids, it was only at dinner they interacted and the rest of her day was hours alone, they all had lives going.  I meshed well with most everyone.  One guy said practically nothing, but was obviously getting something from it.  He was isolated with no real life contacts like me.  They do this every 2 weeks so I’ll do the next one provided I can.  Back crap could sideline me. 

The pandemic was a 'blessing' in this case as I could not physically attend nor would I want to where they are located after dark.  Even without pain I wouldn’t want around the area alone.  

So, a new experience.  Was like an AA meeting of sharing first then open to discussion.  That was the part I liked best.  Hearing people say my name and saying theirs felt warm.  Big talk was the holidays coming up and how much has changed of course.  2 people struggled with doing he holidays for their kids when they felt nothing.  Some were grateful for the pandemic out.  altho the subject was sad, it proved to me my intense thirst for real time connection.  It wasn’t earthmoving, but I did feel less alone when it ended.  Just like I do here when we share.  Hands down it was how no one understands unless it happens to them.  

[scba]

3 hours ago, Gwenivere said:

It wasn’t earthmoving,

 It isn't and it should be ok, because after the massive earthquake you have been through you need those moments in which nothing much is asked from you, just a kind presence and understanding. I came to appreciate serenity and whatever provides for it. 

I hope you will be able to attend again. 

 

[JimJim]

You know I understand that the sole purpose of those of us left here, not going to the other side of the veil yet, is to learn to adjust to being alone now, I will hear this from Doctor's and counselors, therapist's and the like, that word adjust, just what does that mean? I will hear Jim you have to go on, and I wonder go on where, exactly what is it that you are asking me to do, the answer will always be the cold hard fact that Nancy is no longer here, but that I am, so I need to adjust to that fact, that nothing I can do will bring her back!! So my answer will be I understand that cold hard fact, I feel it every second of every day, but still I wish that even after two years, I still believe that I am going to wake from this long bad nightmare, but each day is the same as the day before, nothing to shout about, of feel happy about, to smile about, all my feelings inside gone, my soul left the same night Nancy's did, just a shell of my former self remained, I try to explain that I can't die, as I am already dead inside, now I am just waiting for the Creator to come take me, if life is just a blip, lights out, no second act, well that's okay too, at least I wont have to experience the pain any longer, at least I will be in a blip with my Love, and should there be a second act, well then the plan worked

[nashreed]

Surely after going to mediums several times, there must be at least some peace knowing that Nancy is with you, even if it's not physically. That's all I can hold onto, that there is something to look forward to. (Has there ever been a thread that consolidates what different members experiences with mediums are? Comparing and contrasting them? Seeing what there is in common, if they all "match" more or less?) I just want Annette to be happy. I know she would want me to at least be ok. I have to respect her wishes. Selfishly, I want to give up, but it seems like it's a slap in the face to her memory. I have mobility and sight, which she didn't.  There has to be a purpose for me here, a lesson I haven't learned, a job I need to finish. 

[JimJim]

As a matter of practice, most mediums will not discuss the dark side of life or death, everything that is said is geared towards the positive, that Nancy is experiencing a spiritual growth, and that this is what she she is asking of me, to also continue to grow in the physical world, however I do believe that there are also things that the medium may be getting from Nancy, that due to liability issues she cannot tell me, as they say somethings are better not known, so yes I believe that when you cross over, you are free of all physical pan and are godlike at this point, and you know I also carry that feeling of not giving up, Nancy did not wish to leave, so how would it look like to give something away that she so desperately wanted to hold onto!! I am 60 years old, not much time left as it is, ya know with no ones help, from her side of the family, they left the hospital that night,  and I didn't hear from them for almost a year, didn't even bother to ask me about her arrangements afterwards, they were like life goes on, get over it, so I arranged a plot for the both us, had a Rabbi say Kaddish, and put together a memorial 8 pages of a bio and photos, also opened a website in her name to display her art, as Nancy is an artist, all done and paid for, this was my mission, and now it is completed, so now it is the Creator's turn to complete his mission for me. Thank you

[Gwenivere]

3 hours ago, JimJim said:

if life is just a blip, lights out, no second act, well that's okay too, at least I wont have to experience the pain any longer, at least I will be in a blip with my Love, and should there be a second act, well then the plan worked

Jim, I wrote a post almost identical to this in some thread.  I so relate to the inner feelings you expressed.  I substituted nature for creator as I don’t have that belief.  We seem to feel the same.  An end of this lifeless existence and the pain. I’m not really worried what it will be.  Whatever it is, we don’t have a choice.  Waking up is the beginning of yet another day of 'living' in this shell.  I know when he died, so much of me did too.  So much of the essential me is forever gone.  Doctors annoy me as they can’t or won’t factor the psychological side in.  My therapists and I have butted heads a few times.  Now I’ve laid the ground rules for what I need from them.   That has helped.  Acceptance?  We mastered that a long time ago.  How could we not?  If they were here, we wouldn’t need to master it.  

 

3 hours ago, JimJim said:

Nancy did not wish to leave, so how would it look like to give something away that she so desperately wanted to hold onto!!

Steve and I talked about this a lot.  We finally concluded that whichever of us it was, the other would experience excruciating pain and had the permission to handle it as we saw fit.  No judgements.  No promises because there was no knowing the long term effects of ultimate loneliness.  Knowing death was coming and thinking you are as prepared  as you can be proved to be untrue.

[kayc]

17 hours ago, Gwenivere said:

There was a warmth about being able to see faces and interact in real time.

I am so glad you got this!  So one silver lining in this pandemic cloud.  I've never zoomed, wouldn't know how and am always at my limit on my data usage, which is way too low.  If I wasn't so broke I'd change carriers and get something better.  Not right now.

Had a scare yesterday, my water barely came out, no pressure.  Checked the Pump Tec, it was working.  Wasn't cold enough for pipes to freeze.  Waited a while, it came back.  Neighbor said the water table is real low (in a drought).  It hasn't helped that the country okayed subdivisions this water couldn't afford, make all our supplies less.  Gotta wonder about the officials sometimes!

[kayc]

11 hours ago, JimJim said:

is to learn to adjust to being alone now, I will hear this from Doctor's and counselors, therapist's and the like, that word adjust, just what does that mean?

I only know it took me years to "adjust," which to me simply means "get used to."  It doesn't necessarily mean you like it.  I've always been a person that is a combo, that is part introvert, part extrovert, I like solitude, but need interaction too.  Right now it's heavy on the solitude...too much so!  The pandemic adds to our loneliness.  I've come to rely on these online interactions.  Which is okay if I wasn't limited in my data...and when the electricity goes out, so do my connections. 

 

[Gwenivere]

The only thing I’m getting used to is 'getting used to' things over and over as they keep changing.  And I’m getting less patient/able to do it.  There is no fluidity' in this as there was when Steve and I were living our lives.  Maybe it was more chaotic than I remember, but I don’t think so.  Just doable speed bumps along the way.  Nothing earth shattering beyond losing our parents.  That was hard, but the norm as we aged.   It always comes down to having someone to share life’s ups, downs and changes.  I did OK for a few years and now I’m burned out.  This year didn’t help.  Not only the virus but being forced into Medicare.  Losing Ally.  I do have to say the pandemic has made everything so much harder.  Like, duh.  Can’t really make a move that isn’t linked to it somehow.    Now add in the holidays and the constant political blathering.  Vaccines are good news, but months away and still unknowns for how long they last.  We’ll still be in masks and in fear for a very long time.  

So, getting used to?  Yes, I experience it as we all do.  I’d like to have one damned day that didn’t require it.  One day of freedom to be back in the grief journey I was traveling not becoming more encumbered by more fires turning up.  I can take Netflix messing up my discs.  I cannot tolerate well finding out a med I need Medicare won’t pay for without going thru hoops of appeals.  I’d love to go walk it off or sit and throw the ball for Melody but the pain is too much.  I feel catatonic at times.  Too overwhelmed.  Those times scare me so much.  Even more so, I am losing the ability to find things to distract me for a break. The things needed done like Mel’s vaccination due are like asking me to skydive.  

Everything I do is effort and my body is reflecting it.  I get shakes from fear, pain, maybe a malady....I don’t know anymore.  I got up yesterday morning and stared to light the fireplace candles like it was night instead off opening the blinds.  My therapist says you can’t know you are going crazy because your actions feel normal.  I catch myself.  So if I’m not going crazy, what the hell is this?  (Rhetorical).  

Ive read this but need to again.  I’ll post it about the holidays and mental health for those interested.

Article: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/therapist-predict-holidays-mental-health_l_5fca573ec5b6787f2a977639?utm_campaign=share_email&ncid=other_email_o63gt2jcad4

[nashreed]

Gwen, that's funny. I was wondering at some point if Netflix still sent out actual DVD's still. So, you can get 2020 movies on disc? 

If I didn't have music, I would truly already be in the loony bin (wherever that is). I wish I could help you. It's not fair. I remember staying up nights when Annette was sleeping, looking online to try to find the "cure" to her pain, praying in vain (I have faith and believe in God, but I don't believe he's a wishing tree- that you can't just ask Him for stuff)... I thank Him when I've made it through a day, or when my family makes it through ok. 

It's funny. My family is usually so into Christmas, but because of COVID I guess, they're not. It doesn't help that I will not watch Christmas specials and stuff. I like the lights and decorations, but I worked in retail for so long, I cannot stand the old chestnuts- and those songs are more depressing than Goth Rock or a Sinatra saloon ballad, especially now.

[kayc]

Note the links within the article Gwen shared.  This is a good one: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/tis-the-season-for-the-holiday-blues-heres-how-you_b_58459b2be4b0496fbcb0c272

WISH I could help someone!  Right now I can't even help myself.  The pandemic is having a profound effect on those of us in utter isolation!  Throw medical issues into the mix and you have a real formula for holiday blues!!!

Gwen, I wish I could start with helping you.  I feel helpless right now!  I wish I weren't so far away and I wish my hands didn't hurt so badly!  That's all I want for Christmas!!!

Incidentally, I got a Harry and David package coming today...can't eat any of it, don't know why someone would send it to me.    Meant well but...

 

[kayc]

14 hours ago, nashreed said:

It doesn't help that I will not watch Christmas specials and stuff.

I, on the other hand, wish to ESCAPE REALITY and would like to watch them all!  This year, however, I've skipped recording ANY of them!  Guess I realize down deep it's all but a fantasy...

[JimJim]

Gwen that is so right, we've had to master the acceptance of this so called reality to pinpoint accuracy, like you mentioned, we have no choice, and it most debilitating at times, actually 95% of the time, the other 5% are sleeping, and in some of my dreams, getting more and more of them all the time, where Nancy and I are together, these are the dreams I write down in my dream journal that I keep on the desk next to the bed, so that I can always remember the dream, it's the only time I feel normal again.   As for the holiday approaching, now normally Nancy would celebrate Hanukkah, with the proper prayers, and the lighting of the Menorah, as a matter of fact it start's tonight going through the 18th, this I will celebrate, in honor of her Love that she gave and still gives to me, went out and bought everything needed, so that is set.  Back to acceptance, again Gwen you mentioned that where we go afterwards, if we go anywhere, we have no choice, and you are absolutely correct on this, but as to how we choose to live, that we have a say in, friends and family think I am not accepting the truth, only because I keep a shrine to my beloved, with her pictures all across the living room, dining room, even one hanging in the bathroom, I have her clothes in the dresser and shoes in the rack, as I am expecting her to come home any minute, I want her to know that I haven't forgotten and never will, how can you give up on someone that taught you how to live, I mean really live!! the answer is you don't, and at the end of the day, when she does not return home, well therein lies the reality of acceptance, it's so cold and barren in that reality, that all I want to do is go to sleep, cause only there we are both together physically as one again.  I want to Thank you all in this forum, as it is only here, that I am able to express my true feelings, that others wouldn't or couldn't comprehend unless they've suffered the same loss, and I wouldn't wish that on anyone, Happy Hanukkah and a Very Merry Christmas.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              

[nashreed]

I still haven't been able to dream about Annette, other than her existing in the time frame the dream is in, but not actually being with her. 

Jim, did you find that it took a long time to be able to dream of her? Has she appeared as if talking directly to you or are they more like memories?