Understanding My First Year Of Grief

[mfh]

Dear Dan,

I am glad you returned and hope to see you often. You said you are seeing your doctor to see if you are depressed. I, of course, have no way of knowing if you are or are not depressed but what I can tell you is that all the behaviors and feelings you described are signs of grieving, a perfectly normal and human response to the loss of a beloved. All of us have gone through and many are currently dealing with these feelings and behaviors...signs (not symptoms) of grief. Anti depressants frequently and most often do not relieve these since they are normal responses to loss. Many MDS will prescribe antidepressants even though a person is "just"grieving...Not minimizing grief but separating it from depression. My own MD, who is also a friend who knows me and knows how I feel about all this hinted at meds himself early on and said he knew he was preaching to the choir when I explained that the signs of grief resemble symptoms of depression and that I refuse a Rx which he already knew. He did make me laugh, however, as he and i go around on a lot of things in a friendly way. He wanted to fix what was not fixable. So be aware of this. I also suggest if you do choose a Rx that you see a psychiatrist with training rather than a general MD with little training with anti depressants.

Tears, sleeplessness, low energy and exhaustion, poor concentration, apathy, sadness, anger, staring into space and more are all part of grieving. They lift in time but diet, exercise, sleep, support, and grieving in general are needed. Think it over. We have all felt the way you feel and few, if any, have used medications beyond Tylenol. Just my opinion. But worthy of consideration. Do you have a history of depression previous to this loss. Please tell your physician that if you do. Mary

[MartyT]

Dear Dan, I just want to add my voice to what Mary has said to you. The sorrow of grief is not much different from what is commonly understood as depression ~ but they are very different conditions and require very different approaches. Grief is a normal response to significant loss. It's wise to see your primary care physician to rule out any physical causes for your symptoms and to make sure you are healthy physically, but also I hope you will do a bit of reading so you'll have a better understanding of why you may be feeling this way. As Mary says, as painful as it is to experience it, so much of what you describe fits the description of a normal grief reaction. That is not to say that there is nothing you can do ~ On the contrary, by reaching out for the information, comfort and support you need and deserve, you're already taking appropriate steps to deal with your grief ~ and educating yourself about what is normal in grief is one of the most important steps.

See, for example, the following articles:

Grief vs. Depression by Kelly Buckley

Grief and Depression: Are They Different? by Elaine Mansfield

Seeing a Specialist in Grief Counseling: Does It Matter?

Finding Grief Support That Is Right For You

Note that at the foot of some of these articles you'll find links to other readings, and I encourage you to follow those links. ♥

[danocolor1]

Dear Mary and Marty, Thank you both for your advice. I am going to start getting Marty's e-mail starting june 17 when our daughter gets home from vacation. That is strange to think grief can tear you apart like it does. i will be cautious with the doctor and not just start popping pills. I do not like meds anyway. Thank you both again, i do value your opinion. I will be posting again over the weekend. DAN

[kayc]

Dan,

What you are experiencing is very normal response, all of us have been through it. Also, different losses affect us differently.

[mfh]

Dear Dan, I am so glad you will give thought to what Marty (and I) have shared about depression and grief. They are, indeed, different . I hope you will read the articles she posted for you. She is a wealth of information that is solid and worth your while. When you consider that our lives were deeply intertwined with our spouses/partners in many instances for many years and that we begin to feel and operate like one human being, losing them is like an amputation and you will discover over time how much that loss affects so much of what we do. Our daily lives are completely changed. Almost everything we do was in some way wrapped around this person who is now gone. This is to say nothing of the deep love we shared. It is no wonder when that person is ripped away from us that there are wounds far deeper than people know until they have been down that road. So being patient is the single most important lesson I have learned...patient with myself, with my pain and sadness and with those who just do not know what to do or say to me. Self care is right up there at the top of the list also. So glad you are open minded to what Marty has shared. She knows what she is talking about, believe me...and says it well.

Peace

Mary

[Wifflesnook]

Mary you sum it up so well. I was thinking that even when we try to continue doing the things we didn't share with our loved ones we still find it almost impossible to do them. Because before they died we still knew they were waiting for us, and we knew we would talk To them about everything we did and they would be interested. The losses are so huge that they seem to go on forever. There is no point in trying to minimise them. But we all know that our loved ones would want us to carry on somehow, and this forum attests that we do.

[danocolor1]

Here it is saturday already, it has been a long long week. Usually the weekends were for kicking back and relaxing, but boy how things have changed. I think back to the time my beloved was in the hospital Dec.18 till Dec.25 2012. I vividly remember the doctor telling me that there was nothing more medically that they could do for my beloved JUDY. This was on Christmas day!! OUR daughter Sherri mentioned something about Hospice, which i had no idea about them. She called and a young man came to see us on behalf of Hospice, and I can thank GOD for that. Judy was moved that night and she did pretty good in their care. In my humble opinion i think that those people come very close to "walking on water". I have never in my life met better,caring,and loving people. This is what this website reminds me of very much. Judy would be sooo proud of my trying to be a part of this. Like i said before she meant everything, everything to me. She was my teacher, confident, lover, my strength, my all.

[kayc]

Dan, I found weekends the toughest for a very long time. Even now it seems to stretch on and can be lonely at times. It gets more manageable with time. I agree about hospice, when I took care of my MIL the last three years of her life (she was bedridden with cancer), hospice was immeasurable help.

[mfh]

Dan, I am convinced that Hospice workers ARE angels. They saved the day for me when Bill died and I have heard many stories since. And I agree this Hospice sponsored forum is the same.

You are not "trying" to be a part of this forum. You ARE a part of it. And all here are grateful that you have become a part of our circle. And yes, Judy is smiling for sure. I can't imagine how happy Bill was/is when I reached out for support and got it. I know he knew that I would reach out for help but I also know he was concerned about my well being when he had to leave because we talked about it. I kept reassuring him I would be ok but had no clue at the time how hard this journey would be. Weekends are difficult. They were "our" time especially Sundays. I still dread them. People are all relaxing in their own ways and with family (just as Bill and I did) and the day is long most always...even though I find things to do. There is an emptiness and a feeling of being lost that is beyond my ability to put into words. I wonder if it will ever go away. It is like every Sunday is an anniversary of loss. But on we go. I try to avoid bill paying on Sundays since that is not fun but today...I need to attack the bills and the paper work that accumulated while i was gone to a conference.

Mary

[danocolor1]

Dear Mary, thank you for your response. That brought to mind how I promised my Judy time and again that i would be alright.For her just to let go, she had no more to do. What a brave soul i was while she was still with me [us] her family. What a big chicken i am now. I had no idea how tough this would be!!! She is not here to give me the strength that i need at this point. I don't think that i spoke about her liver disease. She had serosis of the liver, yet she was not a drinker at all. I heard one of her doctors say that it was an idiopathic liver disease because they were idiots and did not know the cause.

[mfh]

Dan, you are NOT a chicken...you get up every day, feed yourself, dress, think of Judy, cry, survive, post here, share your pain. Chickens do not do that. I also believe that she is giving you strength...she is pure energy now...and I believe she (and my Bill) are right here helping me survive and someday thrive. No, it does not make it easy but it does help. I do know people who had cirrhosis of the liver and never even tasted alcohol but I know there is a stigma around that. Yes, neither of us (you or I) had a clue how hard this journey would be. I just want to reassure you that we learn how to live with and carry the grief and the pain lets up...a lot. Grief stays forever.

Mary

[KATPILOT]

Dan, you have it right about hospice caregivers. They are indeed saints. So are the grief counselors. If not for them, I wouldn't even be here. Kathy and I had it better than most. We only had four months from finding out that she had cancer until she was gone. Kathy had done the radiation and chemo and we had three weeks before the surgery believing we were going to beat it. It was only when we went up to Calgary to see her parents that she began to have trouble breathing. After the air ambulance ride to the Mayo hospital in Phoenix, I was told by her doctors that she would only live five days at best. They wanted to go with me to tell her. I just couldn't do that. I told her alone and I remember exactly what she said. "it is what it is" She never cried, she never asked "why me" , she just said she would reach me after she was gone. We moved her to a hospice home next door.

She was the bravest soul I ever knew. I could never be that brave and it tears me up when I write this.

Okay, got a hold of myself.

I almost erased all of this but I think it says a lot of who we are and what we all are going through. And Mary, I don't think it ever really goes away. I went out to dinner with a client of mine who had lost her husband seventeen years ago. He was my customer also as I had been doing work for them since the late 70's. She knew Kathy and was saddened to hear the news. While we were talking, she gave me a lot of insight and at the end of the evening, she said "Steve, there will be sad times. They never go away. You just learn to accept it and you keep on going" She never became involved with anyone else because like me, she had perfection. What does inspire me however is that she enjoys her life. She travels and like me she goes out to dinner by herself. I like that when I see someone so far along on their grief journey who even though they still cry sometimes, they also smile when they think of the one who they love and loves them still.

Hang in there everyone. It never was going to be an easy ride. But we are all here for each other. And in a way, we are counselors too.

Stephen

[MartyT]

"But we are all here for each other. And in a way, we are counselors too."

Yes, Stephen. Exactly. ♥

[kayc]

Dan, that is how it was with me too. I always thought I was this really strong person that could survive anything and it would be George who would have a hard time if he lost me...how ill prepared I was for his death! I had no idea how very hard it'd be! We don't know what it'll be like until we are actually facing it.

[danocolor1]

Dear Mary and Marty, today [MON] I saw my doctor as to whether i was depressed or not, he seemed to think i was. He is going to find me a shrink [i don't know how to spell physi] well,you know. He said that he was first going to prescribe some med for me, but on second thought he was going to leave that up to the shrink. I totally agreed with him, thinking about what both of you had stated. Thank you again. He thought that i was depressed because i had been Judy's caregiver for 14 yrs. I had been that close to her, but i never would have had it any other way. We were very very close anyway.

[mfh]

Dan, Your story sounds pretty typical. Grief and depression have overlapping symptoms and physicians get little to no training about grief. The psychiatrist you see may have none either. I would make sure whoever you choose to see is educated about the grieving process. I am certain that my own MD would have prescribed meds for me, he suggested it during the caregiving days. I refused being aware of the basics of grief. You may call your local Hospice center and see if they know the MDs in the area trained in grief. Usually a psychiatrist (MD) has the most experience with meds. however some clinical psychologists (PhD) are also licensed to prescribe. Just be aware. To decide someone is depressed because they had been a caregiver is not reason enough to call them depressed, in my opinion. How about depleted, grieving, sad, exhausted, lonely? Do be sure you see someone with a background in grief education. In my humble opinion.

Mary

[mfh]

This audio is NOT about grief. It is about self care, depression, meds, and more but NOT grief. It is, however, something to hear in regards to the self care this professional advocates. I do not know how long the file will be available before it is archived and sold but I got it in my email today. It also discusses the real facts about medications used with those who ARE mildly or moderately depressed. This population (mild to moderate depression) are those who most often are using psychotropic medications (anti depressants e.g.) and they are for the most part ineffective with that population. We all know this but MDs ignore it too often. I repeat...grief and depression are not one and the same. A loss like ours results in grief and though a few people may also be depressed, the vast majority are dealing with grief (not depression).

http://www.peoplespharmacy.com/2013/06/08/788-mental-health-naturally/

[danocolor1]

Dear Mary thank you so very much for the link to Pharmacy Group and Dr. Low Dog. That was very interesting and informative. I have been taking fluoxetine for years, i thought it was for anxiety, at least that was what the doctor told me. I bet i have been taking it min. about 12 yrs. To me it sounds better than Prozak, but what do i know about meds. The doctor says to take it , you take it,40 mg. daily.

Dan

[mfh]

Dear Dan,

Glad you liked Dr. Lowdog. Her credentials are outstanding.

As for medications, I do not hear you asking for advice and I could not and would not give it to you if you were but I can tell you that I do not just take meds because the doctor says take it. I research and investigate and discuss. I look at my options. My MD knows I will do that and respects it and sees the two of us as a team. I am my own advocate. We all are. And I do my homework. If you are even considering a change in meds, you MUST talk to your doctor and work with him or her. Do NOT go off of that medication on your own. You MUST do it with medical supervision especially after 12 years iIF you are considering a change. Maybe you are not. I do not know. Fluoxetine is an SSRI anti-depressant prescribed for anxiety among other things including depression. 40mg is an average dose.

Mary

[danocolor1]

Dear Mary, i am not going to do anything until i get to see a psychiatrist. Hopefully he will be informed on the matter. I have no one to ask anymore, Judy is not with me. She was pretty smart on meds, and i did rely on her advice.

Dan

[enna]

Hello Dan,

Back in March - 3/5/2013 I posted a thread called 'Sadness or Depression' and I received many helpful replies. The thread may give you some insight if you choose to read the responses.

Just go to the main forum page and up on the R/ in the box where it says 'search' type the words 'Sadness or Depression' and I think it will take you to my post.

I think you are very brave to be here with us. Our stories are very important to us and we learn so much from them.

Patience and time are crucial when we are grieving. We move through it in our own time.

I found that if I was in the house too long by myself that I needed to go out even if it was to the store or to fill the car up with gas.

I even started to go to Lowe's (a home hardware store) just to walk the isles thinking I'd be closer to Jim. It is good to distract ourselves so the overpowering loneliness does not consume us.

You will have the highs and lows during this grieving time. You will not walk it alone. I have found great comfort coming to this forum. I don't know about medications nor do I know if someone needs to be on certain drugs - only a doctor can determine that. What I do know is that grieving is not depression. We are not sick. We are hurting from the loss of our spouses. It lasts forever BUT it does get a little bit easier. I am one year out now and there are times when I have laughed. I go out with friends for lunch. I am even looking forward to a roadtrip to San Diego with some teacher friends I used to work with if I get the ok to travel this summer!

I want to visit some of the wine vineyards again and go out on the ocean and even spend time at the San Diego Zoo. And I want to get out of the triple digit temps here in The Valley of the sun!

I miss my Jim every minute of each day but I don't focus on it 24/7 now. Things get better. Anne

Edited June 12, 2013 by MartyT
Link inserted

[mfh]

Dan, that is smart. The psychiatrist will know about the meds...that is his or her job. I do know that feeling of having no one to ask. It was so natural just to turn to our partners for help, input, sharing. Today I had an item in the car that was too heavy for me to lift out and I had to have it out so I could take Bentley to the groomer tomorrow...so once again...I pick up the phone to call someone for help. I needed a strong man to get these out of the car. I am not used to asking others for help but I am getting good at it.

Peace to your heart,

Mary

PS When do you see the MD?

[danocolor1]

Mary, i saw the MD on mon. and he said he was going to get me a psychiatrist so i am waiting for his nurse to call me and let me know.

Dan

[mfh]

Yes, Dan, I remember that. I just did not know if you were given a name. Do let us know how that meeting goes when it happens.

Mary

[danocolor1]

Dear Mary, I finally have an appointment with a psychiatrist on July 20. It is a while to wait but we will try and be patient. I will let you know what happens.

Dan