Jump to content
Grief Healing Discussion Groups

Lost My Heart Dog One Week Ago Today


Kacy

Recommended Posts

Last Sunday, about this time, my little Cavalier, Allie, went into a seizure and died in my arms before we could get her to the ER. It was not a peaceful death.

Allie was a rescue that we adopted 5 years ago. She was truly my favorite of all of the many dogs I have owned over the years. We had a very special bond. She was 100% sweetness and joy. I truly love dogs - all dogs. But my feelings for Allie were over and above that.

Cavaliers are prone to heart disease and all 4 of my Cavaliers had heart murmurs when we adopted them. It's almost a given. Allie also was diagnosed a few months back with lung disease. They generally go into congestive heart failure before age 10. Allie was 9. She had some labored breathing in January so we took her to the cardiologist, thinking she was going into CHF, even though her respirations were normal. According to the xray, she was not in chf. They told us it was her lungs. There aren't really a lot of things that help the lungs in a dog. At least with CHF, they can try to keep it under control with medication.

A few weeks later, we took Allie to the internal med dr in the same hospital as the cardiologist to see if she could treat the lung issues. After running many tests, she saw that Allie had a slight bit of fluid in her lungs. She consulted with the cardiologist and then told us to start her on 5 mg of lasix. I questioned that as that is not nearly as much as our other dog had been started on when she went into chf and not the normal starting dose. They assured me it was correct. Allie continued with the labored breathing but otherwise was acting perfectly normal and eating well.

Back to the cardiologist a few days after that, where she promptly changed Allie's meds to the dose I expected in the beginning. Right there, I'm upset. These two vets work right next to each other and yet this vet allowed Allie's dose to be incorrect, even though she knew better. I don't think she was happy that we had gone to the other vet for Allie's lung issues as she felt she could handle them herself.

Allie continued on - no better and no worse. I checked her respirations daily. They are the 1st sign of a dog going into CHF that you will see at home. Her respirations were good, and she was eating well and acting normal. The labored breathing continued though. I decided to try a inhaler treatment that the vet had mentioned, even though they said it may or may not help. They kept saying it was her lungs, and I felt like we should at least try something to help.

After a few days of the treatments, I felt like Allie was getting worse. Last Monday, her respirations went up to 48. They had been 24 the day before. I thought she was going into chf. So, we took Allie to ER that night. I expected them to keep her in oxyen overnight or at least give her a lasix injection. They took an xray and said the fluid was no worse and there was no point in adjusting her diuretics. They offered an inhaler treatment, which I refused. I tried to tell them she seemed worse after the other inhaler medication and that I thought she was going into chf. But they said the xray did not show that. They had called the cardiologist and she had only said to give the inhaler medication.

We took Allie home. The next day, I spoke with the very rude vet tech from the cardiologist's office. She said to continue the inhaler treatments, even though I told her Allie seemed worse after getting them. She said it takes 2 weeks for them to kick in. Saturday night, I was up half the night with Allie. She was restless and having trouble breathing. I didn't know what to do for her because I kept thinking it was her lungs and there really wasn't much to do.

Sunday morning, I felt like she was going to die if we didn't get her somewhere. Going back to the same ER and spending more money did not seem a good option. We have never had a good outcome there no matter what we went for. I wanted to take her to another ER where many people take their dogs with heart diseaes but it is 2 hrs away. That was my plan.

But Allie went into a seizure and before we could even get her to this close ER, she died in my arms. it was absolutely terrible. I can't get the picture of her out of my mind. I know she is at peace now, but she did not deserve to die that way. In my mind, she should not have died at all.

I actually joined this list last year when I lost my other Cavalier, Lucy, very suddenly to heart disease also. She was being treated by another cardiologist and her respirations were actually very good the morning that she died. She literally went out the door to go do her business, seemingly fine as we had just taken her respirations, and walked back in a few minutes later and collapsed and died in my husband's arms. We were devastated. Our regular vet asked about an autopsy, but we refused. I later regretted that decision as we never really knew why Lucy died and I was still struggling with that. She was only 6 1/2 years old.

The ER was holding Allie's body for us until we could arrange cremation since she died on Sunday. Monday morning, when I was thinking a bit clearer, I knew that I wanted an autopsy done. It is not a pleasant thought, but I felt since Allie's symptoms did not seem to make much sense, let alone her death, I wanted to know just what this lung disease was (there are several different causes). We made the arrangements and took her on Tuesday.

A few days later, we got the preliminary results back. Allie died of congestive heart failure. I was not expecting that. The report said she had widespread pulmonary congestion. I was devastated. I have diuretics here that I could have given her had I known. Not only could we have increased the one she was on because she was on the minimal dose, but I had another one that I give my other dog that is even stronger. I don't understand how they could have missed this and kept insisting it was some type of lung disease.

We will not be getting the full autospy report back for a few weeks, but I doubt that will change anything. I have not heard anything at all from the cardiologist - not even a sympathy card. Maybe that will happen next week, but I am not expecting it. They are aware we took Allie's body for an autopsy.

I am so lost without her. She was the light of my life. I have no idea how I will ever accept this. As I said, I was still having a hard time dealing with the sudden loss of our other Cavalier, Lucy.

I am thankful to this group for having a place to pour out my heart. I'm sorry this is so long.

Mary

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 143
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Posted Images

Hi, Mary, I remember you. I had never heard of a Cavalier before your post about Lucy, very beautiful dogs, they look very sweet indeed. I am sorry you've lost your Allie, it doesn't seem like all that long ago you went through this before.

I have a hard time with these callous vets who don't care about or understand the animals they are treating. I have run across much of the same treatment you have. For many years I had a wonderful, caring, country vet and I guess he spoiled us...now what I run across is something I want to shield my animals from. Horrific stories. I am so sorry for the misdiagnosis. I know we always wonder "what if" and wish we could go back and do things differently, but it's especially hard when they've been under medical care and it was inept at best. My heart goes out to you in your loss. Sometimes you wonder if the vets would pay better attention if a law suit was brought against them for malpractice. I know, the chances of it getting anywhere are slim, but GRRR! you wish you could get their attention all the same!

Do you have a picture of Allie you could post?

I'm just so sorry you're going through this again. I, too, have had dogs all my life and loved each one but am the closest I've ever been to my current one. I understand how devastating this must be for you to lose her.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Kay,

Thank you for your kind words and understanding. I just miss Allie so much. I love my other dogs but as long as they get a certain amount of my time during the day, they are okay to go off on their own to lay on the couch or run around outside. Not Allie. She was always right there with me, wherever I was.

As for the vets, I truly wonder if there are any good ones anywhere. If it doesn't fit the picture exactly, they seem to be clueless. What's even worse is that so many just seem to be more interested in your money than your dog. There doesn't seem to be much compassion or concern for your dog. When Molly, our other Cavalier, was in ICU in oxygen for 6 days, they never even called when she came home to see how she was doing or if there were any problems. I guess they figured I would call them if there were. While she was in there, the resident vet did call with updates, but then the receptionist would call with a daily update on our bill and asking when we would be able to pay more on it. Every time I would see their # come up on caller id after the vet had already called, I would think something must have happened to Molly and answered the phone, expecting bad news - only to find they just wanted more money. I realize they are running a business and people sometimes try not to pay, but couldn't there be some kind of compassion there also?

That's wonderful that you have your heart dog now. I think they only come along every so often, if you're lucky. In my case, I truly believe there will never be another Allie.

Mary

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Kacy-

I am very sorry for your loss. I know nothing I can say will fix things but I just wanted you to know there are compassionate vets out there. The night I had to make the decision to say goodbye to my beautiful Kylie, my vet came to the animal hospital to be with us. She stayed for nearly two hours and helped me through the most painful decision I have ever been forced to make. I don't know how I could have gotten through it without her there, comforting both Kylie and me. I will never forget her kindness that night.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you. I agree there are compassionate vets. My own regular vet is one who has always been there for us. But even with her, I don't feel that I would get an honest answer about Allie's autopsy report because she will not want to go against anything the other vet did. While I understand that, I guess I'm to the point with vets that I'm tired of it. I just want someone to put the welfare of my dogs first.

I feel like I need honest answers to my questions, and I'm not sure where I will be able to get them.

I'm sorry for the loss of Kylie. It's so hard.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I know there are compassionate vets too, I had one for thirty years, but I haven't run across one since. My dog is large and I get tire of size discrimination. Plus he has anxiety and is afraid to let the vets do anything so it's not easy, but you'd think they'd understand animals' natures, apparently not. Sometimes if they'd let me help they'd get further because he trusts me and knows I have his best interest at heart. Sometimes I bring my neighbor along to assist with him because he's Arlie's favorite person in the world, and that's helped too. But when the vet has to do something that's going to hurt or scare him and they won't even let me be there with him, that is upsetting to me. Or when they don't act concerned when he can't hold a tsp. of water down, or don't care if he lives or dies, I take exception to that.

I agree that we deserve honest answers. And I wish instead of doctors and vets standing up for each other, this unwritten code that they have, that they'd stand for truth and yes, put patients first.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Omg, Mary, I had actually come here to (finally) write something about my own trials, and then saw your post, and just about fell over!!! I had just been thinking of you again last week, but didn't clue in the other day when quickly skimming through emails, that this was you posting here again! I can't tell you how very, very sorry I am that now you've also lost your dear Allie!!!!! :( :( :( And so soon after your beloved Lucy, too! You must be just shattered!!! I'm so, so very sorry, my friend.

Even though I've sadly and angrily become all too familiar over the years with the gross incompetency and the heartlessness of what seems to be an ever-growing number of "bad" vets out there, it's still always so heart-breaking to hear about yet another instance, and worse yet when it happens to someone you know. And you've been dealt this kind of nonsense more than once now!!! As I can well imagine you must be too, I'm so sick of how too many of them just refuse to even listen to not only the knowledge that their client may have gained through past experience with their own animals, but also to that inner sense any animal parent may get that tells you something's very wrong, or that, "no, we should maybe do this or that differently"....or even just, "please, check again" for x, y, or z. I'm just stunned that you're going through something so similar again, and wish I could change everything that's happened for you, and of course for dear Allie. :(

I'm glad you asked for an autopsy this time, but certainly also share in your feelings of shock, and likely outrage, that Allie's diagnosis was just WRONG! Omg, I'm sure it's all too much to take in, much less try and deal with. I had always wished we'd had one done for our own fur-son Sabin, too, but I was too inexperienced and ill-informed back then, yet have wondered ever since if the results would have just made me even more enraged than I already was over the level of vet care he didn't get that he should have...

I also understand, truly, how a horrific-looking passing can affect us so badly, as I've gone through that, too. It's an incredibly tough thing to carry with us...as if "plain" grief isn't hard enough as it is! I don't know what you're able as yet to hear in response to that, or what might just make matters worse for you, so will just say for now that you have my deepest, most empathetic sympathy for all the emotions and thoughts such a death brings up.

I'm simply SO horribly sorry for all you're going through, and what you've been through already. Please know that even though I'm still dealing with my own losses, I'm here for you to whatever extent I can muster up. I seem to have lost any eloquence I once had, but still try my best. And please DO let us know what you end up finding out, and what and how you do with all that. I also hate to even ask at this point, but surely am hoping your other furkids are hanging in there. You're certainly going to need each other more than ever now, I imagine...

{{{{{{{ :unsure: Big HUGS from me to you!!!!!!!! :( }}}}}}

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Kay, I just had to respond to a couple of things you'd said, too:

...and they won't even let me be there with him, that is upsetting to me.

I agree that we deserve honest answers. And I wish instead of doctors and vets standing up for each other, this unwritten code that they have, that they'd stand for truth and yes, put patients first.

I've learned through hard experience, and from far too many horror stories from others I've known as well, including one vet tech who was fired and blackballed for whistle-blowing...to never, ever leave our babies' sides during any procedure, except for during actual surgery, when you're never allowed in the Op room. (that said, I was even allowed there once for at least the anesthesia portion, during an involved dental operation!...what a compassionately GREAT vet that woman was!)

I could not agree MORE with your last statement!!!!!!!! In currently becoming a part of the massive grassroots pushback against poor Tiger's murder (the cat who was deliberately hunted and shot by a vet in TX, that went viral on the 'net), this case is proving the "taking care of their own" attitude is running rampant, when her license hasn't even been revoked so far, despite the utter heinousness of her crimes. Imo, we have to start demanding more from these professionals, or we're never going to get it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you so much. I can't tell you how much it means to know that there are people who truly understand, and I know that you do. I feel like I want to scream at people - "don't you understand? I lost my Allie!" My life has changed. People don't understand that. They think you "just" lost your dog or cat. No, I lost my best friend, Allie. She died in my arms. How would you feel if your lost your best friend suddenly?

I keep going over and over it in my mind and telling Allie how sorry I am that I didn't help her. What will make this all worse is when the final report comes back on the necropsy, and my vet will try to convince me that it wouldn't have mattered about increasing the lasix. I don't believe that. Dogs do recover from CHF. They are not cured, but at least their care can be managed. I saw it with my other Cavalier, Molly.

I would like to find a cardiologist who would look a the report and answer my questions, but I don't think any will be willing to do that because they aren't going to want to say anything against another vet. Plus, they automatically think you're going to sue, which I'm not.

Maylissa, I'm sorry to hear there has not been a resolution in your situation. I don't now why, when people are willing to care for and love the animals, they have to be taken away from them - in one way or another.

Thank you again.

Mary

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh, Mary, you did try to help Allie, though. It was the vets who came up so short, not you. And when we're wracked with worry and fear, it's nigh impossible to come up with everything ourselves, much less being forced into battle mode with the medical profession. I just wish they would realize how much worse they make it for the ones left behind.

I understand how it's often too hard to believe they aren't just telling us what they imagine we want to hear to 'make' us feel better....sigh. While at least this is showing they might have some compassion for us, it's still not honest. And maybe that's what's needed -- to let them know in no uncertain terms that what would help MORE for our grief would be total honesty from them....including the addendum that we aren't thinking of lawsuits, either, but just of personal HEALING. Sometimes too, we have to let them know how much we've come to discover in treating our other animals, and hope they can show us some respect and regard for that, too. It's a 2-way street, after all.

I won't even kowtow to that old "necropsy" vs. "autopsy" difference in labels regarding the perceived status between nonhumans and humans. It's the same procedure, so I insist on only calling it an "autopsy." Let them deal with their own discomfort and belief system, I say, and I'll stay true to mine.

I wish I had a ready answer for you about how to find a vet. cardiologist who would provide an honest assessment (and who's also really GOOD in that specialty), but I've not heard yet of anyone who's gone that route and been successful. But maybe you could do some digging online and see if you can find anything? Remember, too, once you have the full report, it's yours forever, so you may find something later on even if it's not there right now.

And thanks for your sympathy about my own situation. Last I inquired in the Fall, the cats were "fine," end of answer. But I discovered one of the daughters was then wanting her parents to get her a dog. (the feline fur-boy, most especially, could never be "okay" with a dog) She's learned to be equally as self-absorbed as her parents. So I put calls into all the closest rescues for their possible future adoption, should they ever try to dump these cats back on any of them instead of calling US first...or if they just LET them get "lost." People just don't care, and particularly not about "just cats," who've been so wrongfully maligned, misunderstood and mistreated for eons. So frankly, I'm sick of most people. "Stranger in a Strange Land," I am.

You're always welcome, Mary. Keep us posted, okay?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Maylissa, the times in question were at an emergency animal hospital and it's their policy so you have no choice. When it's night time and you're 60 miles away from the nearest emergency clinic, you're lucky to even get that, and they have their hard and fast rules. I despise them. One of the times was when my dog ingested rat poison, you only have a short window of time for treatment and we're 1 1/4 hours away from the emergency clinic. They refused to let me even stay on their premises when I took him in! They said they'd call me, so I went across the street to my office and waited. As soon as they called I was back there. It was then that they told me they couldn't get the charcoal down his throat. WTH didn't they let ME try, or at least be there to assure him?! By this time the window of time had passed and I had to wait six weeks to find out if he'd live through it or not. Unbelievable Another time was with my cat, who died of cancer. Another emergency clinic, which I'll never go to again. They took him back and wouldn't let me come and I strongly suspect they did not spend any time on him. They misdiagnosed him, gave incorrect treatment, and by the time I took him in to someone else, he'd suffered needlessly for a month longer than he should have. When I called them to tell them of their wrong doing, they never apologized. To top it off, they charged exorbitant rates. I, too, have had good care from vets and even emergency clinics, but that was way in the past.

Mary, People should never judge another's loss. My dog IS my companion, my best friend, my incentive for living, the joy of my life! He's not "just" a dog, he's my everything! If someone isn't an animal person, and doesn't get it, they should at least understand we're all different and have the decency to keep their inappropriate comments to themselves. I'm so sorry you've had to endure that on top of your loss.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Kay,

I do believe there is a major problem with most of the veterinary ER clinics. They just are not staffed with drs with enough experience, in many cases. Of course, why would a vet who feels he/she has paid their dues want to work weekends and night in an ER? So, what you are left with is young, inexperienced vets, who even though they may have specialists on call (as in the case of the ER hospital we used), it's not the same as the experienced vet actually being able to examine the dog themselves. Plus, one some cases, these are not just dogs with broken bones or ear infections. They are dogs in life threatening situations.

Twice now, within less than a year, we have been in situations where neither the specialist nor the resident specialist has been in town when our dogs had a health crisis. In both cases, I asked for an ultrasound because I felt like something drastic had happened to my dog (and, unfortunately, I was correct), but there was no one there to perform one. In one case, the dog pulled thru, but waited 2 days for that ultrasound to show that there had been major damage to her heart. In the other case, my sweet Allie, she was not as lucky.

Mary

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am just so sorry for your loss. Do you have any dogs left at home now?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, I do. I have 4 - love them all, but Allie and I just had a special bond. They each have their own personality and while all sweet dogs, 2 are just as happy to be outside as to be with me. The other two are sweet and loving, but they are just as happy to be on the couch as to be with me. Of course, all like attention, treats and petting, too.

Allie was the one who was always at my feet when I was on the computer, in the kitchen when I was in there, even had to be in the bathroom with me. She had a way about her that took your heart.

Mary

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mary & Kay,

All these stories are horrifying!....and despicable. Yet as I've discovered, they aren't nearly as isolated as most people who have been lucky enough so far, would like to believe. It's only when we're faced with an emergency situation or serious illness regarding our babies, that we become part of the "in the know" sector of animal parents. It's not surprising, but naturally, the veterinary profession has followed in the footsteps of the human medical 'care' model, and sadly, infuriatingly, it now also contains all the same hallmarks of poor and deficient practice. Because the entire paradigm is backwards, in a nutshell. We and our animals are the ones to suffer for it, and die from it. I hate it all, and have for ages, but still, not enough people care, are still in the dark about it, or are unwilling to step out of their comfort zones to try and effect change in and around it. And naturally, we most often don't even find out for the first time until we're hit with a death, and then we're grieving too freshly and hard to have the energy to do much about it, after the fact.

But it's disgusting at any rate that now we almost have to BE top vets ourselves in order to really trust (or not) what they're doing! How is that fair, or right? And as practically anyone in the biz will tell you, the ERs are the WORST. But Mary, they're not always young and inexperienced docs, either. I've heard of a few who either came from, or from there went on to the larger kill shelters to work. OR, they ended up running some big clinics that were known (within the biz; the public remained unaware) for rampant animal abuse behind closed doors. That likely either means no one else wanted to hire them, OR, that's their bent to begin with -- to care that little about animals that they're more than willing to keep killing off the "surplus," as they like to call it, &/or abusing animals. And a lot of ERs also have the worst of equipment, too.

That's how my precious boy, Sabin, ended up dying. The ER x-ray machine was older and untrustworthy to begin with, we found out. Add to that the lack of expertise of the vet who took and viewed his first lung x-ray = recipe for disaster. She'd thought it was just their admittedly lousy equipment that showed a slight "shadow" in his lung, as apparently this happened a LOT there!! WTH??!! Meanwhile, it was actually cancer...that metastasized so rapidly we couldn't get a handle on it fast enough due to the time that was wasted. But it was her mistake in the first place, misreading it, then not suggesting we check it out further, elsewhere! (what did I know back then?!) But you'd think our integrative vet would have known about the ER's faulty equipment, and taken immediate steps herself to re-check. By the time she suggested it (when Sabin wasn't getting better after ~another week) and also called in a top oncologist to verify new x-ray results, it ended up being too late, even though we tried a few alternative treatments anyway. So I found out the hard way, too, as most of us do, and for over 15 yrs I've been trying to warn others of these dangers, but generally no one listens until it's too late for them and their babies. It's absolutely heartbreaking.

_________________________________________________________________________

Mary, I do understand that extra-special bond some of us have with certain individuals, and the ultra-tough grief that creates when they go. It was of course that way with my own kidlets (having had them since kittenhood & pouring my heart & soul into being their Mom). It was also an instant "like attracts like" familiarity like this between myself and the fur-boy who asked me to call him "Biscuit," and later his brother, too (once I'd met him as well), each of whom we'd tried to adopt from yet another negligent, uncaring family. And yet, I often wonder, too....could that bond have ended up just as strong, deep, and tight with others as well, given enough time and willingness on my part? This is one of the lessons I believe Nissa was aiming to teach me, bless her soul. Now I often think it's mainly been my lack of wanting to open up my heart AS fully with some of these others (because I was hurting so bad), that really made the biggest difference. As I've always said, love is fundamentally a choice, and if I've learned nothing else, most animals respond massively quickly and in the most heartwarming ways, once you've made that choice, even if that initial attraction to each other wasn't as strong as with others.

So while I know you're in terrible pain at present, maybe it's just a wee thought to put on the backburner for later, months or even longer from now. I guess I'm just trying to offer you some hope for the future, if you're able to create a similar, or just as strong, bond with your other furries once you're not in this much pain. Only because we know that love does help us heal. I liken it to me and Carly. He always seemed so loyal to his own people (no matter the neglect), yet so rapidly blossomed with me in just that month's time, because I started feeling much more attached to him, myself, and firstly, so he responded in a way he never had before. Of course this isn't meant to take anything away from what you need to focus on NOW, or the deeper connection you and Allie shared, but just to hopefully take a little bit of edge off that natural panic that arises when we've lost someone we loved so hugely, and can't imagine our lives without them in it. So I hope it doesn't come across as offensive to your bereavement. :mellow: But if your remaining furkids can help you heal, and vice-versa (if they're grieving Allie's absence, too), that would be a good thing for all of you. :wub:

I know it's just SO hard, though...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Maylissa,

I like how you always seem to learn something from the animals and situations you come into contact with, you'are a positive person and a wonderful animal advocate.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dear Mary,

First, let me add my voice to those who’ve offered sincere and heartfelt compassion for the loss of your beloved Allie. I am so very sorry and, as one who also lost a dog I considered to be the light of my life too, I have some understanding of the pain and heartache you’re experiencing now ~ especially given the circumstances surrounding Allie’s death.

I’ve waited until now to respond to your post because I wanted first to consult with my colleague, a dedicated veterinarian specializing in hospice and palliative care, who kindly serves as my professional consultant in cases such as yours.

She says that the only way to know if the care your Allie received was negligent is to review the records of the cardiologist and the internal medicine specialist ~ and of course without the medical records, my consultant is in no position to render an opinion one way or the other ~ but she does think that you did the right thing by requesting an autopsy. She suggests that you then request the records ~ although she’s not sure if they will be given to you. If that happens, she suggests that you get a second opinion from another cardiologist who could review the records on your behalf. You can also request a review of the case by contacting the veterinary licensing board in your state (see https://www.aavsb.org).

In the end, I know that there is nothing we can say that will ease your pain or bring back your beloved Allie. I hope and pray that you’ll take comfort in knowing that you did everything you possibly could do for her, including the heroic treatments you tried your best to coordinate with different ER vets under very confusing and frightening circumstances. I doubt that any one of us would do much better. I am so sorry . . . :(

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Maylissa,

I like how you always seem to learn something from the animals and situations you come into contact with, you'are a positive person and a wonderful animal advocate.

That's very nice of you to say, Kay. Thank you! :) Though I've always advocated for animals and can't imagine ever not, in this last year or so I think I've sadly felt anything but positive. I've lost so much more than I've gained...except for a return of way too much body fat! :blink: ....the one previous, positive side effect I'd had in the last month before losing those 2 feline loves of mine; anxiety & grief always makes me shed excess pounds. So maybe I'm just grasping at whatever straws might save me now. Still, thanks again for that. :wub:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Maylissa,

How sad that your Sabin's death was due to an incompetent vet with outdated equipment - and then to for her to admit their equipment was faulty is unbelievable. We trust these people to care for these animals that we love and bring to them to help. Don't they understand that? I think that some do, but I'm starting to think they are the rare ones. I used to be so naive to think that they actually are there because of their love of animals and truly care for each and every one of them, but I'm starting to think they only see $$$$ when they see us coming.

Maylissa, you don't have to worry that you will offend me. We are all here to help each other, and I know that whatever is said is for that reason. It's hard with my other dogs - I love them dearly, but it's not the same as I felt for Allie. It just isn't. I do feel that, in time, I will be able to focus more on them, especially Molly who is also dealing with the chf. Who knows how long she will be with us. She is doing great for now, but I've noticed her cough might be getting slightly worse.

BTW, you have not lost your way with words! "Stranger in a strange land"? Maybe many of us posting here feel the same way about ourselves. I honestly would rather spend time with my dogs than with most people I know.

Mary

Mary

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Marty,

How very kind of you to check with your friend about Allie's treatment. I truly don't feel it would do any good to pursue filing a complaint. I already am pretty sure my regular vet, who was not involved much in Allie's care after she was being treated by the specialist, will say that congestive heart failure can come on very quickly. I know that is true, but I also know that I tried to tell them she was going into CHF because of the overnight change in her respirations. They always made sure to say that if things got worse, to bring her back in. So, it almost gets the monkey off their back and puts it back on mine. Of course, I keep thinking I should have taken her back in, but with no cardioloigst there, what good would it have done? They seemed stuck on the idea that it was her lung disease causing her problem.

When our other dog died suddenly, I did contact another cardiologist clear across the country to get his opinion of her treatment. Unfortunately, I was so distraught, I faxed the records I had on Lucy that included the cardiologist's name. That cardiologist then stated that Dr. So-and-so was a good doctor and he was sure she did the right thing. He did not want to be involved in any lawsuit, although I told them several times I was not looking for a lawsuit.

In Allie's case, they kept saying the xray was not showing more fluid in her lungs. I don't know if it is possible for a dog to have widespread congestion and not have it show up on xray. I have contacted a company that does animal autopsies and asked if they would be able to answer my questions if I hired them to read the final report when we get it. The person who emailed me back said the vet was out of town until early next week, but he was going to pass along my questions, and he would let me know if she felt they could give me the information I am looking for.

I just don't know why I didn't just give her more of the lasix. Our other dog is her size, and she is getting much more. I guess I just wasn't thinking straight. They had me believing it wasn't the congestion.

Marty, thank you again for your kind words. I know you truly understand, and I'm so sorry about the loss of your own heart dog.

Mary

Link to comment
Share on other sites

How sad that your Sabin's death was due to an incompetent vet with outdated equipment - and then to for her to admit their equipment was faulty is unbelievable. We trust these people to care for these animals that we love and bring to them to help. Don't they understand that? I think that some do, but I'm starting to think they are the rare ones. I used to be so naive to think that they actually are there because of their love of animals and truly care for each and every one of them, but I'm starting to think they only see $$$$ when they see us coming.

...It's hard with my other dogs - I love them dearly, but it's not the same as I felt for Allie. It just isn't. I do feel that, in time, I will be able to focus more on them, especially Molly who is also dealing with the chf. Who knows how long she will be with us. She is doing great for now, but I've noticed her cough might be getting slightly worse.

..."Stranger in a strange land"? Maybe many of us posting here feel the same way about ourselves. I honestly would rather spend time with my dogs than with most people I know.

Yah...although actually, that was only one part of it -- that old equipment part being at the ER we had to rush him to initially. But you'd think, with the higher fees they charge at ERs, they'd have enough for better equipment than most regular vet clinics! For my boy, the #1 reason he got so ill in the first place was because our integrative vet wouldn't heed my concerns a few months earlier, when we could have had lots of time for treating him. I KNEW something very wrong was happening, and that's when she SHOULD have investigated more than she did, and more to the point, should have started treating him homeopathically for his presenting symptoms!!! Of all types of vets, she should have understood that the most CLEARLY, since that's where homeopathy can really do the trick, before something worsens to the point of no return! But she failed us, both then, and when he was dying later on. And also when I was desperately trying to get him at-home oxygen equipment. And when he needed a home-call euthanasia. So many botch-ups, from everyone, all throughout. It was all a brutally tough lesson for me, all-told. That being said, because absolutely nothing I chased up seemed to go right (there was much more than this), it did end up leading me to the idea that for my boy, it must have really been his "time to go," no matter how much I wanted and tried to stop it. And of course all I learned helped my girl, his sister, in both her illness and dying years later. He loved his sister mightily, as he did me of course, and the interim years gave me that much more time to increase my knowledge base so I could help my girl more. Sabin gave straight from the heart and soul, right up until his final moments, and for the GOOD OF ALL of us. :wub:

So I've learned that really, you can't trust that many of them, which is also why a health team can work better, so you can bounce one piece of info off against other docs in your team, and just hope that at least one of them isn't weak-hearted about having another perspective or idea. I certainly agree with you (and the many more who've learned like we have) that the exemplary vets are, or have become, pretty rare nowadays. You have to learn each one's strengths and weaknesses, then extrapolate their service use & info from there. But again, the added pressure that puts on US, the panicked and worried animal parents, is enormous! But the ones who don't truly care would never even THINK of all these ramifications, so sure aren't going to try and remedy anything without a great, big SHOVE to do so.

I do really understand "it's not the same" as how you felt about Allie. For me, I don't think anyone or any other relationship could ever measure up to what I had with my kidlets...and certainly not with any human. Maybe some could come close, though, depending. Yet that doesn't discount the level of love and attachment I ended up feeling for so many of these other cats, much to my surprise. So no, they weren't the same at all, but it's just that over time I learned I did indeed have that much room in my heart to include them there to a far greater degree than I would have thought possible after losing my own beloveds. Even with Shannie, I didn't realize just how very MUCH I'd come to love her...until the moment I heard she'd be taken away from me. And she wasn't even my "type" to begin with, if you know what I mean! ;) The funny thing is, she kept growing more into my "type" the more time we spent together and the more I included her in both my heart and daily life....mainly at HER insistence, of course! So that's all I'm really saying. I still sit here, shocked that this even happened, yet I know the whole thing has my kids' blessings, too. But keep in mind, this whole process has taken me years and years.

However, all you have to concern yourself with for now, is NOW. That's all you can do anyway, and you'll feel however you feel, and that's all A-OKAY. What you had/still have with Allie will always be all it is, and nothing can take that away from you. In fact, if you do end up using an ACer or whatever other means to stay in more aware contact with her soul, you could end up with even MORE to your continuing relationship with her. As Marty's been fond of saying here, a relationship never dies, it only changes in some ways. Your special girl with always be special, and the more you can expand on it, even now, the more of a treasure trove you'll have, forevermore.

Perhaps Molly will play a bigger part in all this than you can see right now. Even if not, she still needs you, as do your other furries, and I hope you can all help support each other to the best of anyone's abilities. After all, we all heal most optimally with, and as, a family unit. And of course animals in particular are masters at helping humans heal.

As for feeling like "strangers," for SURE huge numbers of us prefer being with our animals way more than with most humans! I've always felt that way, and as so many now say, the more humans I know, the more I love animals!!! I'd meant that more as a critique of being in a world that doesn't value other species as, at a minimum, equal to humans. Personally, I think we're very substandard by comparison.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Okay, the whole "quote" function didn't work for some reason, so I've had to just C&P what you'd said instead this time:

"Of course, I keep thinking I should have taken her back in, but with no cardioloigst there, what good would it have done? They seemed stuck on the idea that it was her lung disease causing her problem.

...they kept saying the xray was not showing more fluid in her lungs. I don't know if it is possible for a dog to have widespread congestion and not have it show up on xray. I have contacted a company that does animal autopsies and asked if they would be able to answer my questions if I hired them to read the final report when we get it. The person who emailed me back said the vet was out of town until early next week, but he was going to pass along my questions, and he would let me know if she felt they could give me the information I am looking for.

I just don't know why I didn't just give her more of the lasix. Our other dog is her size, and she is getting much more. I guess I just wasn't thinking straight. They had me believing it wasn't the congestion."

I agree..."what good would it have done?" without a specialist there to confer with, and especially if they were so narrowly and rigidly focused on "lung disease" instead? You can't blame yourself unnecessarily for that logic. I probably would have been thinking along exactly the same lines. So if you need to be angry, frustrated, or whatever about THEIR failings, just allow yourself to. There's nothing wrong with any emotion, even the so-called 'negative' ones. And I think you already know how to put those kinds of feelings to good use, to work for you, rather than against you. You've done it before, and can do it again.

I also agree about it sounding very odd that that much fluid wouldn't be detected by x-ray. I'm no x-ray technologist, though, so maybe you could also go online and find a resource where you could ask about exactly that. Do you have the actual x-rays yourself, and if not, can you request them? Remember, they form a part of Allie's medical record, and since she was legally your "property," by rights, I believe they could be YOUR property now....just as our own medical records can usually be requested if we want them, even if there's a fee attached. At least that's how it works up here. You could try asking for them "just because" you'd like "everything" to keep that was Allie's, now that she's gone.

You're being very astute and creative about finding out whatever you can, by whatever means you can, and I wildly applaud that! (we'd make a good research team, you and I! ;) ) If that autopsy company doesn't work out, try another if you can, or heck, try one in Canada instead, where suing isn't considered as common as in the US and maybe they'd be more willing to talk!

For the Lasix, well hey, you were trying to do right by the "expert" advice, and you were frazzled and upset at the same time. So even though you thought of it, you were duped into focusing on the wrong diagnosis first of all, and not wanting to maybe make anything worse or do anything wrong, either. Once more, who could blame you for, heavens, not being an actual vet, yourself!? I am just SO anguished by all these stupid, reckless mistakes that vets are making with people's precious animals, that then leave their people wracked with guilt that doesn't even belong with them!!! And then they go merrily on with their lives, while they've totally ripped apart those of the very sector that they should be considering as the BEST and MOST valued one for their own daily bread and butter!

I don't want you to keep taking on all that guilt, and yet I also know how that goes for those of us with (a) some brains, and (B) the very hearts that CARE that much about our animals. I still carry some guilt myself, no matter what I've learned since, so I know it's no easy-peasy thing to just let it go. It's easy for some people to say, "ah well, you live and learn," but not when it's a matter of life or death, at least not if you loved someone deeply, and especially if you're a "responsible" type, too, as I think you are, and as I am, too. Then it's much harder to deal with. So you have my utmost compassion for the hurdles you're facing, emotionally and cognitively. Inner debates like this just plain suck.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Today is two weeks that Allie died. It's like she was never here, and yet, I miss her terribly. She brought so much joy to my life that without her, there is just an emptiness. I feel like she was just yanked out of my life, just like Lucy, and it's hard to understand why.

My son brought her ashes home yesterday. He lives near where the autopsy was done and the funeral home that did the cremation. It was hard when he walked in with the bag containing the box with her ashes. It's like there is no denying it now. I haven't been able to look at any of her pictures. I guess that's my way of dealing with her loss - just avoid thinking about her.

We have to take one of our setters for a checkup tomorrow. This is the one I'm thinking of asking the rescue group to find another home for. Have not made a decision yet. I had been putting off her vaccine just because I feel they are unnecessary, but it will have to be done before the rescue group would place her somewhere else. It's going to be hard not to talk to the vet about Allie. This is our regular vet, who is very caring but at the same time, will not dare saying anything about Allie not receiving proper treatment from the specialist. So, I'm thinking for now I will just try to not say anything at all.

I'm hoping to hear back from the veterinary pathologist next week as to whether it is possible to get answers to my questions. If it works out, I will get her opinion plus the opinion of another vet I had consulted with by phone as far as the final autopsy report when we receive it. If they agree that Allie's medication should have been adjusted, then I will meet with my regular vet at that time. I want to have something more than just my gut feeling that Allie was going into congestive heart failure. Not that it's going to matter.

Maylissa, I agree - the specialist has gone on to the next patient and probably hasn't given Allie a second thought, unless she's worried about a lawsuit since she knows we had the autopsy done. Also agree, that people will talk about the "live & learn" notion but as you mentioned, and not many seem to understand, this was Allie's LIFE we are talking about. How do you get past that?

Mary

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mary,

I'll be thinking of you tomorrow as you may see the vet again.

Wouldn't it be easier for us if the vets responsible for bad determinations owned up to it, apologized, gave their condolences, and learned something from it for their future dealings? Probably a pipedream, but...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...