Violent Deaths

[Elizabeth A.]

Okay so, I come here, and I talk with you all... And most of the time I feel better... But in this box, there are painful memories and issues... That I can't seem to work through... I always feel like I'm not ready to post about it... So I let it slither along the ends of my mind. But lately I've been having trouble with mental images. Every time I try to work it through in my mind, I hit a landmine and have to distract myself.

It's so nice here. It's like my life before, I really have struggled. We come here looking for answers or a better way to cope, and I feel almost as though bringing this in is like a blood splatter or something.

So here in it's completely skin and bones minimum, is what happened. On Dec. 14, 2007 Oliver the husband in our family of friends, killed his two children Olivia age 4 and Magnus age 2 in their beds, either before or after no one seems to know he also killed his ex wife (the divorce was declared in October) (they were married nearly a decade) her partner whom I never knew, in their bed in their apartment across town. He broke into their apartment through a broken window walked through the apartment stepped over the partner's daughter who was asleep on the floor, killed both women and fled the screen, he drove south and just after one of our Florida bridges he shot himself.

I tell you I don't understand it. I sat with this family. I knew Magnus from the time he was 6 weeks old. I watched them grow. I watched the love Oliver had for his children. I saw it all. I saw the way Jenn would sometimes look at Oliver when he interrupted her, but what wife is happy with her husband every moment of the day?

The news reports and commentary tell of Oliver abusing Jenn, that pains me to no end that she was hiding that, having to keep it all within herself, that she didn't feel she could share. They talk about Jenn's partner and how a man is somehow allowed to go crazy if his wife becomes a lesbian. Why does that play any role here? Believe it or not, Oliver filed for divorce, Oliver took everything, the kids, the house everything. Jenn didn't fight at all she let him have everything! Yes, they had all forms of dept imaginable. But how do you get from all that to the images I can't get out of my head of Oliver walking over to his children's beds and shooting them! I mean did he kiss them first? Did he say goodbye? Did he just walk away? I don't get to know the answers. Nobody does. And though I know I'm not the only one hurting over this, I feel like this cross is getting heavier and heavier.

Would you believe he actually called his children’s school to tell the school that they were all going to “have a fun day”? A Fun day!??!

Would you believe I realized why my cat Tiny keeps finding me when I cry? She knew them! My cat was a neonatal kitten when we met them. Every time Friday we would go over to their home for Childbirth Classes, I had to take Tiny in the beginning, because she wasn't weaned! My cat was in their house and knew them. Saw them.

I trusted this family I respected him. I put my heart and soul's worth of desire into those classes and into trusting them. I can't change that I will be forever grateful to both of them for the safe arrival of my daughter. But every time I try to understand why the images rush in.

I've thought maybe if I let the images come maybe they will wash over me and give me an answer any answer to the questions I have, but every time I get stuck with Oliver standing there in that house over his son or daughter and then I don't know what happened, so I get locked into the image.

I suppose should be happy, since I've been coming to this website the headaches I'd get every time I'd think about it, are oh 85%-90% gone. But part of me feels like this is worse.

This is actually the furthest attempt I've gotten in writing this out so I'm going to post it now, before I decide to delete it. Maybe I’m not looking for answers. Maybe I just need understanding. And if it matters, I do feel sorry for putting this out here like this, but I don't know what else to do. I have hit that wall with my family and friends, you know the wall, the it's been nearly three months. They were only your friends, life moves on so get a move on already. I am expected to be my same old me, but I don't feel like my same old me. I feel like I have a hole in my heart...

[Mrcelloboy]

Dear Elizabeth.

So sorry that you have to deal with this.

My partner of 10 years, Kathy, died Nov. 10 2006, when she was run over on her bicycle by a recycling truck.

Just this morning I found myself again replaying an image of what I imagined took place (there were no people on her side of the truck that witnessed the accident).

I think that in traumatic loss this is one of the common ways we deal with our loss.

At about 16 months I'm starting to feel like I'm really beginning to recover to the point of being able to have happy memories at times, rather than just hurt.

There are things like what you and I have to deal with that can never really be understood, but I believe we can eventually come to recover enough to be whole again.

Be patient with yourself. I've learned that there's no "right" or "wrong" way to grieve.

Maury

[karenb]

Hi Elizabeth,

No wonder you've had headaches, images, and all those thoughts. The whole thing is tremendously horrific. There's no way to put understanding into it, except that he was so terribly ill to have done it. It's so very sad that things like this happen, but in a world of us imperfect people, imperfect things happen that we simply can't even fathom. Have you thought of some individual or group counseling for events that have occurred like this? It would be hard to go through it alone, even with such good people as we have here - everyone one here has gone through very personal trajedies and deals with it differently. You try and hang in there and come back often to say whatever you have to. We care about you.

Your friend, Karen

[Corinne]

Elizabeth,

First I want to say that I am so sorry you are dealing with this loss. Second I am truly glad you brought it up. You do need to talk about it and let it out. Let me give you a quick rundown of what I've been through and how I handle it, maybe it will help, maybe not since everyone is different. Eleven years ago my precious husband who was dying of colon cancer shot himself on Christmas morning while I was in the shower, then last Feb 24th my fiance went to a pool tournament at 11:00 a.m. he drank all day and then after midnight decided to walk home through the woods in 17 degree temp.. They found him 2 months later. For a very long time I would picture my precious Jimmy when I ran out of the shower and found him. With John I kept picturing him freezing to death and tried to imagine what were his last thoughts. After a while I realized that recalling the picture of Jimmy was not helping me in any way and there was no way I could possibly change what happened so every time it came into my mind I pushed the picture out. Eventually that picture went away. After I lost John, his family turned on me and I decided to see a therapist because I was losing it and I knew our little girls needed me. I did go on an anti-depressant and that calmed my mind enough that I could finally hold a thought.

Elizabeth you will probably never have the answers to the questions you would like answered just as I will never have my answers. When horrible things like these happen, you never really get over it, but you can learn to let go of or keep in that little box what you'll never understand and just grieve for the horrible loss life and begin to heal. I hope that something I have said will help you. Please keep posting about it when you feel the need it is necessary for your grieving.

Hugs & prayers,

Corinne

[DesertBob]

Elizabeth,

Ah, Elizabeth ... I am sorry you have had to deal with this.

Your thoughts about such a terrible, tragic event are completely understandable, humanly speaking. Philosophically speaking ... the hardest thing about tragedy and loss is to accept that most of the time we'll never have completely satisfying closure about it. My wife Linda died a slow, painful death over many years and one morning I discovered that she had become a mottled corpse with a vacant stare. These kinds of images (real in my case, imagined in yours, since you didn't actually witness any of it --not that it matters much) tend to lodge themselves in one's limbic system, as does any trauma. Around and around it goes, seemingly with a life of its own.

Oliver's insanity (and even how thoroughly cloaked it was from you and others) can be explained in clinical terms -- narcissism, sociopathy, or whatever; Linda's death was the logical conclusion of a long and difficult illness. But the fact remains that innocent lives have been destroyed. If a sufficient rationalization exists for that, I'd like to know what it is. And the truth is, when it's YOUR loved one(s) that die, or are murdered, or whatever ... your criteria for "sufficient" gets a LOT stricter. This is personal.

I decided 2 or 3 months ago to quit asking "whys" that will never and can never receive an answer that would be satisfactory to me. I am doing my best to live in the present and focus on whatever happiness I can find in it. I try to observe myself and catch myself in any obsessive, repetitive thought patterns, consciously stop, and distract myself with other things. It has worked quite well, for me at least. My mantra has become, "it is what it is". I don't have to approve of it, or like it ... but I have to accept it. And when I do, I am able to find beauty and peace in my life. I am able to reinvent myself and build a new life.

I wish that for you. These deaths are still fresh for you -- and it doesn't seem possible to you now -- but better days will come.

Best,

--Bob

[lyn]

Elizabeth,

I am so sorry that you have to go through this. I understand. My father was murdered 15 years ago. One will think I had gotten over the images, but I didnt. I can still clearly imagine the way he died. I have seen the photos, have seen how cruel one person can be. I would not want to describe it graphically but it stuck with me even up to this time. It is very traumatic, I still feel sad that he died that way. I was 14 that time, but I have also learned to forgive the man who killed him. It was not easy, I turned to God to help me forgive him and eventually, the forgiveness came after 2 years. Eventhough the verdict was given, I didnt feel that it was enough to compensate the way he killed my father. But I tried to leave it as it is and I let go of the anger and hurt.

With the death of my fiance last year, my faith was shaken and I am on the process of building my life again. As what Bob said, I have decided to stop asking the whys many months ago and tried to leave things as they are. It takes lots of conscious effort to stop the thoughts and images from coming, but it will be worth it once you get used to stopping it. It worked well for me too. There's nothing more I can do but to make the most of my life now, to try to enjoy the present and find some peace on it.

I wish you continous peace and healing. Please hang in there, continue to post here, we listen and we care for you.

[shell]

Elizabeth,

I can't add any more than what the others have said, except my deepest sympathy for having to endure such an unspeakable horror. I liked what Bob said about "it is what it is". I think that's all the "sense" we can make out of anything! I'm so glad you finally wrote about this. Just talking about things helps so much, just getting it out. I hope it also encourages others, who may have stories that are not the normal death from an illness or disease, to talk about their stories too. Sometimes we feel strange talking about suicides or murders, but it might be even more important for people to talk about those incidents. And the fact that they weren't relatives, but friends, makes no difference at all. It still takes a terrible toll on you. Hang in there.

Hugs,

Shell

[AnnieO]

Elizabeth,

I am glad you shared your story here. I know it took me along time to post the truth about my parent's death, but after I did, I felt so much better.

I too , could not get things out of my head...there were so many unanswered questions, so many mysteries, so many lies...I just became obsessed with all of it and couldnt move on. I had to let it go. I agree with Bob, I also told myself, "it is, what it is". I will never understand it, I cannot change it. I remember when my parents got sick my dad said, he was sad and didnt want their illness to be all that anyone remembered about them. I agreed, its how they died,but they were so much more than that. Maybe someday you will be able to just focus on your friends and remember the good things about who they were not how they died. Easier said than done, I am sure. You are in my thoughts.

[Elizabeth A.]

Thank you all. Your comments and compassionate words make me feel as though a warm blanket has been placed on my shoulders. Seriously I feel like a small child whirling around in the sunshine on a hill full of friends.

I have been keeping very busy since my post, as that seems to help drive the images away. It’s in the peace and quiet that I feel haunted. My sister decided a short time ago that I needed sometime “away and out”. So she took me on a mini-vacation to Disney World. I have a nice set of sunburned raccoon eyes; because I let one of her friends talk me into skipping the gooey mess of suntan lotion. Right or wrong the sunburn has a pleasant sting, the sting of being alive.

My friend Jenn and her family gave me wonderful gifts, spiritual and informational gifts. I hate what happened to them, but I will spend the rest of my life knowing how blessed I was to know such an amazing woman. The deaths of the children are much harder to think upon. Olivia died just 6 days before her birthday. Her birthday is the same day as my sister’s, so I know I will feel the ripples of this for a long time to come.

My responses are for everyone, but I am so grateful for all of your contributions, I feel that each deserves a special acknowledgement, for everyone that has posted has given me little pearls of wisdom from their lives. Thank you.

Lyn~ You mention forgiveness and I will have to work on that one. I don’t have any right now. I will try. I knew Oliver, before this I would have called him a friend, but I feel I was wrong and was really a mere acquaintance of his. I have always felt that the world loses something with someone dies. I feel this deeply with the loss of Jenn. She had a wealth of information that she shared willingly and happily. Part of me feels that Oliver robbed the world of the gift of knowing her, when he took her life.

Mrcelloboy~ I am sorry you also have the images that go with not “seeing”. I don’t think I would wish not “knowing” images on anyone. I find that through my life I have less and less resistance. Which is to say I let everyone tell me whatever they need. I guess I’m somewhat like a Magic Eraser, soaking up and helping others, cleaning and forever taking into myself; their hurts and pains. Each time it takes a little of me but I give it more freely every time there is a need. I read a book once that said that as long as a friend remembers you, you’re not lost to this world.

DesertBob~ You talk of reinventing yourself, I feel more like I’m being remade over, sort of like clay ever changing in shape and use. I am a better mother for having known all my dearly departed friends. I am braver and more sure of myself and my abilities (and limitations) than I have ever been in my entire life. I feel rather like everyone I know, Jenn especially have given me pieces of themselves. Allowing me to be a better person. I know without a shadow of a doubt that internally I am a stronger person than I was when I first met my friends.

Your comment “This is personal” is exactly correct. I feel that I would love for Oliver to have a “strict talking to” perhaps only a warped sense of self can ever full rationalize the horrors of this trauma. I do try to live in the present, and I’m sure, my daughter helps ensure that I focus forward. All the same I do sometimes find myself looking back down the path and thinking “oh just a few short months ago…” In some ways sitting here is rather like a dream. (weepy laughter) when do I get to wake up? I know, I know. I don’t get to wake up. This is real, no matter how much it hurts my heart to know that.

Corinne~ Isn’t it terrible that the world goes through it’s paces with all manner of horrors? My cousin, who’s list of tragedy seems longer than my own (even know I know how we deal with things are all our own and no tragedy can be measured to be any bigger or smaller than anyone else’s), says that reality burns through into our lives, into our protective bubbles to remind us that the world is really like. I think that is an extreme way of looking at life, but her thoughts have helped me in the past, so I will try again to allow her words and thoughts to sit on my mind and my heart perhaps they will help me find order.

What you have been through is unexplainable, as I have found myself liking the phrase "God doesn’t give us more than we can handle," less and less. If that was true then why do people like Oliver, go mad? Why are there suicides at all? We all make our own choices including but of course not limited to how we deal with tragedy. We’re all in this ocean of life together. We live, we die. Some of us are better grounded, but that isn’t always better, as sometimes just floating will wreck less havoc.

AnnieO~ It is true, our last imagines of someone seem to naturally over ride our love and joy for a person, it takes a real intentional effort to force the bad away and be happy with the good that a deceased friend gave us. Perhaps that is why I feel a regular pull to call Jenn, as I had tried to call her just 36 or so hours before her death. She wasn’t always great about returning phone calls. I have a “venting” journal. That’s the one where I write down my most extreme emotions. I have ranted and raved to my dead father in them, I have found peace with his choices as well as the people and the lies he chose to tell in that journal. I have made peace with people I no longer have contact with, more through the passage of time than anything else, and the list goes on and on. I keep telling myself it’s time to write to Jenn. I know it will help. But just as it took me over a month to find this place after her death and nearly 3 months to post my deep grief, I’m not quite there yet.

Maybe it’s because I feel I will vent to her about the loss of the world in her death. I hold no animosity towards Jenn and would wish no suffering upon her, neither in her life nor in her death. Perhaps her life is still to recent and I fear my unhappiness would prevent her from going to her final joy and resting place. We did not share the same faith, so I struggle wondering if I will see her again in heaven. I found this on a Unitarian Universalism (their religion) web site, when I was trying to find answers:

A Unitarian Universalist dies, and on the way to the afterlife encounters a fork in the road with two options: "to heaven" and "to a discussion of heaven." Without pausing, the UU heads right to the discussion of heaven.It was listed as a joke, but I don’t find it funny. I am certain I will find no answers there.

Karen~ You are the first - to respond to my very first post, and for that your options and overflowing certain are special to me. Imperfect people you say, and yes we all are. Part of me wishes to yank of the “brand aid” so to speak and move on while the other seeks that soft cushion to protect my heart, not from loving but from the pain.

Shell~ If we were neighbors, I’d take you my homemade chicken soup and we could sit around for hours talking about anything and everything. My own neighbors always seem to listen, but never really talk. That of course concerns me, as I don’t want to be the one everyone gossips about. Perhaps it’s to late for that. Ah well, we will be the cat ladies of the south.

[shell]

Elizabeth,

I would absolutely love to have you as a neighbor and friend! And yes, we could talk for hours. I know what you mean about how people listen but don't talk. I feel that so much. I know some of my neighbors already think I'm the crazy cat lady...but, ya know what? I couldn't care less. That's one good thing about grief, it makes you care less about a lot of things! I could use some of your chicken soup too! If you ever come this way, let me know!

Hugs,

Shell

[Guest Gamer205]

Elizabeth, I would also like to offer my deepest sympathy to you and tell you I am so sorry you've had to deal with this kind of thing,

Thank you for trying to make me feel better the other day in my post, and I hope that I can say something to try and make you feel better to,

Again I offer my deepest sympathy to you and I wish you only the best.

[Elizabeth A.]

Thank you Robert for your warm thoughts, as you know we have good days and bad ones alike. I think it was Shell who reminded us that friends, parents, children, it doesn't matter who we've lost, it still hurts. Pain is pain, a doctor would never say oh you have a stab wound that must hurt less than a bullet. Just as the loss of your friend is a loss to the world, so is the loss of my friends. There's still that hole where they used to be, but we are blessed because as long as we remember them they live on in our hearts.

Take care.