What's At The End Of The Grieving Process?

[Ron B.]

Lost my Mom to leukemia 3 months ago, in early November. Grief hit me hard throughout December.

Now it's late January, and I thought the grief would ease up. Instead it's rough. Despair and crying, sometimes for hours.

Found some hope; I bonded with a caring and soulful woman. But now that seems to be floundering. More grief.

Then several days ago, I had a heart attack. Or so I think. Felt like someone stood on my chest for 6 or 7 minutes.

Lost my job last July, when taking time off to be my Mother's caregiver. Still unemployed.

So where does this road lead, that started with the illness and death of my Mother?

Has your grief eased up as months passed?

Did you get any kind of education out of the process of grieving?

Thanks in advance,

Ron B.

[derby]

Ron,

First of all I am so sorry for the losses you have endured. I can relate a bit of what you write of. My husband died Oct. 2009 leaving me and our only son. My son is only now feeling the depth of his sorrow. The grief has left him questioning many aspects of his life. It as well is affecting a wonderful relationship he is in. From my propective, I can see that he has little of himself to give to the young lady he loves. He is using all his energy to work through his loss. All the different feelings and losses one feels when watching a parent pass on- seem to carry over with relationships and friendships. It is a very trying time for a son, whether it be a Mother or Father which one lost. I only share this with you in hopes it may help to know anything you are feeling is normal. Physical systoms are common, although the feelings of having a heart attack require the attention of a Dr. Its also my belief that by going through this process we will learn. What we learn will be unique to each of us. My heart goes out to you and I send my thoughts your way. Blessings to you. Debbie

[Ron B.]

Debbie,

Thank you for your kind and thoughtful words. I feel some remorse for 'unloading' my grief on others here, but I have no where else to turn. I can hardly read posts in these forums, because the grief of others simply overwhelms me. But, I have browsed these forums, so I have some idea of the grief that lurks among us. Yes I am surprised at the persistence of grief. I keep thinking that I am supposed to learn from this experience, but then I think, learn what? I find myself swimming in raw emotion, and sometimes I don't know what to make of it.

To be honest, my current grief is less about my Mom, and more about the woman I recently bonded to. Just last night I phoned her and began to understand she wants to go her own way.

Thank you for mentioning the obvious, that after a heart attack it's wise to see a doctor. It's only when someone cares, that I'm prompted to take any action. Made an appointment with my doctor after I read your post this morning.

I saw a counselor several times about my grief and loss, but then stopped going. Figured I was getting over it. Well, I sure got that wrong. Now I see that I really do need the help. Plenty more pain before I get through this. God grant that I learn something. Thanks again.

Ron B.

[MartyT]

Ron, dear ~ I am struck by the title of your post. You've barely taken the first steps in your grief journey and you're already wanting to know what's at the end of it. I want to gently encourage you to just slow down. I think the reason you're feeling your grief more acutely now is three-fold. First, your mother died barely three months ago, and it normally takes that amount of time just for the initial shock and disbelief to wear off. Right about now is when you'll be hit with the full force of the reality that your mother is dead and you're never, ever going to see her in person again in this lifetime. It takes a while for a harsh reality like that to sink in completely. Second, if your lady is sending signals that she "wants to go her own way," you may be feeling what's known as anticipatory grief: mourning a loss that is yet to come. So you may be experiencing what I would call "grief overload:" one significant loss coming on the heels of another. Third, current losses nearly always reawaken feelings attached to other recent and past losses. Finally, you cannot yet know whatever lessons are to be learned from these life-altering experiences until you go through them (that is, you cannot go around them, under them or over them, and you cannot skip past them). Grief is a process, not a single event, and it requires your time, some work on your part, and your complete attention. So I say again, slow down! Learn about what is normal in grief, what reactions are common and typical, and therefore somewhat predictable. Discover what you can do to manage your reactions. Listen to what others have to teach you about this process. Do some reading about grief. You might benefit from visiting the Death of a Parent page of my Grief Healing Web site ~ and keep reading the posts and threads in the forums you'll find here. Most of all, know that you are not alone. We've all been where you are now, and we will walk beside you as you find your own way along this road.

[Ron B.]

MartyT,

I hoped in this thread to have 2 or 3 ordinary people tell me something of their journeys through grief. One person did that. I don't believe it's wrong to ask what's at the end of the grieving process. Or what someone learned. You, however, come on as an authority. You lecture me, like I know nothing. In fact, you can not possibly understand my grief, precisely because it's not your grief. It's mine. And I'll share my experience as I please, and with whom I please. If you had a specific real-world experience with your own grief, I'd be open to reading about it. Otherwise leave me alone.

Ron B.

[Daughter2010]

Ron,

First of all let me say I am sorry for your loss. What you are going through is the worse type of pain anyone can feel because unfortunately there is no magic recipe that will make it go away. As far as what Marty said, I don't see it as her lecturing you or anything like that, but rather providing you information about grief, the different stages, and feelings that people may go through but it doesn't mean this happens the same way for everyone. We all express grief and mourning in different ways and there is no right or wrong in this.

To tell you my story, my father passed away three months ago to cancer. Tomorrow it will be exactly 3 months since his departure, and I miss him so much. He was, is and will be the best father I could ever ask for, and for that I am grateful to the Lord. I know I will not see him anymore, or listen to his voice on the phone, or be able to tell him how my day was or ask him for advise on different matters.

The days after he passed I found myself feeling the emptiness and the shock of him not being there with us, his family. As time has gone by I have learned this pain I am feeling may not go away ever, and it is ok. Unfortunately for all of us, death is a part of life, and all of us at one point in time will experience the loss of a loved one (father, mother, brother, etc). Have I cried a lot? yes, have I felt anger? yes, have I been depressed? yes, have I bargained with God about my dad? yes....I have experienced all of these emotions in a roller coaster. There are better days than others, but it is part of the process.

I don't suppress any of these feelings, because it is healthy to mourn, it just reminds me I am human and even though I know my dad is ok where he is, I can't help but miss him, and wish he were here with his family. It is something I don't have control of. But I sure want him to be proud of me, and want to do things that would make him smile and even if I am depressed, he would want me to keep on going and not let sadness take over me.

My mom says I inherited a lot of my dad's personality, and I like that, that way is as if my dad stayed within me.

His passing has sure changed my life and the way perceive it, along with my relationships, and it is ok if things change. Somehow, I will find the strength to keep on going and be the best person I can be. My dad may not be here physically but I want to make sure he is smiling wherever he is if he sees his family moving forward with life.

My dad will always stay with me,

So give yourself time, be patient with yourself and the grief, if you want to drop by and comment here, you are more than welcome. People who have experienced this kind of loss can relate and understand even if their grief is expressed in different ways.

Big hug for you,

-L

[mlg]

Ron

I think you totally misunderstood what Marty was trying to tell you. First of all, without her none of us would be able to use this forum because she started it all. We all owe her a lot. If you read about her you will know that she HAS gone through this process and that is why she started this. She would be the first to say that each of us has our own grief and only we can go through it but she can and will help in any way that she can.

I am two years and a week out from the loss of my husband and if you are like most of us you still have a really bumpy road to go down. You are still in what "we" call the foggy stage or numb stage. Most of us at about 9 months hit a brick wall as we start to come out of that stage. Each of us goes down this road at our own pace so no one can tell you when it will end for you. There are people who didn't even start "grieving" for 7 or 8 years out. They kept everything bottled up inside them. If you read some of the old posts you will see that most will tell you that you have to hit it straight on and work through it because ignoring it will only prolong it.

I know sometimes it is hard to read the posts on here and at times they set us all back, but when you are able to give that first helping hand it will start bringing you out of the darkness.

[Ron B.]

L,

I feel like someone finally understands me, in that you too have recently lost a parent. I can't explain the grief to others who haven't been through it. And I am not seeking textbook explanations of what it's all about. It's the actual people going through the grieving process that matter to me.

In my case I had almost 2 years advanced notice that my Mother was going to die. I spent a large portion of the last year with her, for several months as her caregiver. We went through all the family photo albums together, and she told me the stories of her life. She did not want solemn ceremonies when she passed, but instead wanted a large festive occasion. So we did exactly that, and had a hundred plus people over to her house for full lunch, drinks and live music. The next day we chartered a boat and scattered her ashes and flowers into the sea. If there can be such a thing as a "good death", this was it.

The grief really only hit me a month later, when I returned to my own home in the San Francisco Bay Area. Although the grief has overwhelmed me, I am convinced there is some point to it all, and that it's just not all just haywire emotions. In fact I know that I have already substantially changed. I have always been a bachelor, and never felt a need to marry. After my mother passed, though, I feel strongly that I want to share my life with someone. I also have a level of emotionality that I never had before, which prompts me to be more thoughtful. On the negative side, I've less tolerance for things and people that waste my time; I've only got a couple decades left to play.

I saw my doctor today, and she is pretty sure I had a panic attack, rather than a heart attack. I am greatly relieved. For the several days I thought I might have to write up a will to dispense my possessions. Glad I can forget about that for a while.

I feel somewhat bad about having piled up my woes in a post to this forum, but the community here is a life saver for me. When in deep despair I know I can come here and find others going through the same process of grieving. Thank you.

Ron B.

[Ron B.]

mig,

Ok mig, I'll tell you honestly what got under my skin. Marty felt it was ok to publicly analyze the grief I was going through. But I don't like being analyzed. I find it distasteful. I don't even like tagging someone's grief into stages. Saying that I'm 'foggy' or 'numb' doesn't sit well with me. I come to this forum to share grieving experience, not to be psychoanalyzed.

And it's ok for you not to like me; that is your privilege.

Ron B.

[MartyT]

Dear Ron,

I must tell you (and others reading this) that I am deeply sorry to learn that anything I’ve said to you – or to anyone else in these forums, for that matter – felt as if I was lecturing you or publicly analyzing the grief you are experiencing. That certainly was not my intention. This is a public forum, after all, and I would hope that anyone posting here does so with the understanding that what is said here is available for everyone to read and comment upon. When I choose to respond to someone’s post, I recognize that what I say to that individual may not have resonance for that particular person, and he or she is always free to ignore or disregard whatever I’ve said – but I try to construct my responses with the hope that the same information may be helpful to others who may come along later and read the same post or thread.

It may surprise you to learn that you and I are in complete agreement on nearly everything you wrote in your first response to me. There is absolutely nothing wrong with asking what’s at the end of the grieving process and what someone has learned from the experience. That is precisely what you should be asking in a place like this, and I support completely your right to ask those questions! I think you’ve received some wonderful, heartfelt responses so far, and I hope with all my heart that you will continue to hear from other of our members too.

Additionally, you are absolutely right in saying that it’s not my grief; it’s yours. While I’ve certainly experienced loss and grief myself and have spent the better part of my professional career working with the bereaved and learning from them about their grief, I am not and would never claim to be an expert in anyone else’s grief. Your grief belongs to you as an individual, and I would not presume to take that away from you. You are the expert on your own grief, and how you choose to understand and deal with it is for you alone to decide. There is no right or wrong way to grieve – there is only your way, and you must discover that for yourself. But I have learned – through my own experience, education, training, reading and research – that there are both healthy and unhealthy ways to grieve, and I do my best (when asked) to find and point mourners toward those healthier ways.

Obviously I misunderstood what you were seeking when I read your first post, Ron, and, in my hasty attempt to validate and normalize your experience, offer you some reassurance and point you to some information that I thought you would find helpful, I missed the mark entirely. For that, I hope you will accept my sincere apology.

[derby]

Ron,

Thank you for gettting checked by Dr to rule out a heart attack. I am so relieved it was not, although panic/anxiety are not fun either. I have been a receipent of those as well. Especially after going thru stress and you have certainly been through major stressors. Oh Ron, I wish I had the words to offer you comfort, just as I wish I had the right words for my son. I will take the liberty to tell you how much it meant to my husband that our son was there with him as much as he could be. Being a Mother myself, I can only imagine how much it meant to your Mom that you were there for her, helping to make her journey loving and peaceful. It would be my wish that son would be with me to do all the things you did for and with her. Ron, please stay close to these boards as we all are going through grief in different ways, and in different stages. I have found insight in what others have written and suggested. I find the rest of the "world" sometimes oblivious to our process, our needs, and our feelings. Bless you Ron as you navagiate through this. And I believe as well the right job will come along when you are ready for it too. You have a gift with words. Blessings Ron. Debbie

[Ron B.]

Marty,

I just want to be among people who are actually grieving. That's all. I do not want public counseling; I do my counseling in private. Broadly talking up generalities about grieving, without currently experiencing grief, is what galls me. I believe the only true expert on grieving is the person currently experiencing grief. These are the people I am seeking out.

I stand by what I wrote in my previous post. If you write specifically about your own past or current grief, I will gladly engage you. Otherwise, please leave me alone.

Ron B.

[kath]

"Broadly talking up generalities about grieving, without currently experiencing grief, is what galls me. I believe the only true expert on grieving is the person currently experiencing grief. These are the people I am seeking out."

Ron,

I'm sorry for your loss, but to exclude those of us that are further on this journey because we are not in the exact same place as you is to do yourself a dis-service. I bonded really well with those that were close and and who came along after my own loss because I could relate to what they said when I couldn't find the words. (My husband died at 56, I was 48 and we had been together for 27 years.) But it was those that were further along, that had already been through the worst and SURVIVED are the ones that gave me HOPE, understanding, love and reassurance that where I was was completely normal. You never forget the feelings or emotions that seem to permanently scar your soul, especially when reading the story of a new poster. It will bring you right back to that day, that hour and that second that you experienced the same thing. No journey is identical. We are all unique in our grief. But it is through the miracle of sharing that we gain strength to continue and eventually are able to reach beyond ourselves to help lift up the next heartache. Because we are here, we are experts, and I am sure not one of us is happy to own the title.

Marty is the only reason we are here. She saw past her own hurt and built a home for us that struggled because there really was no other place to go. Her advice and knowledge has been a Godsend to so many of us. I pray she does not stop offering that which she gives so freely so as not to insult someone that is too hurt to accept the help. It's like any place, take what you can away from here and leave the rest. Not every response will click or even make sense. No one is trying to be a miracle worker here. They are, however, just trying to help.

Kath

[mlg]

Ron

I never once said that I did not like you. This is not what this site is all about. For me anyway and I think for most it is a place where we can freely express our grief and hope there is someone out there that is a little further along as well as those going through it at the time that can offer words of wisdom that may help us. This journey is no fun and is a windy, hilly journey and we just try to put up road signs to help those just starting the journey. I was not trying to psychoanalyze you or insult you but letting you know how many of us have felt so you would know what you are feeling is "normal" at this point.

In defending Marty, I was just trying to get you to see that maybe you had taken what she said in a wrong way. I was sure she did not mean to offend you as you can see in her post.

I have not lost my mother, but I have lost my father and at the time thought it was the worst thing in the world because I was such a daddy's girl. It took me several years to be able to accept the fact that he was gone. I did this mainly because of the love and support of a wonderful husband. Well, 2 years and a week ago I found that the grief I had for my dad was minute in comparison to the loss I have felt since losing my husband. It is something that I am not sure I will ever be able to accept. I have a huge hole in my heart, just as you do.

I am glad that you got to spend the wonderful time at the end that you did with your mother. So many have not had the time or opportunity and I'm sure envy you. She must have been a wonderful woman to want to go through her life with you and your celebration of her life sounds wonderful. One thing Tom wanted was for everyone to raise a drink to him at the funeral dinner and I had a hard time getting them to stay for this. That was one of his last wishes and I know he would have been so hurt that they felt so little of him, but begrudgingly they did and thus, I was able to fulfill one more of his wishes.

It sounds as if you have gone to some kind of counseling, but have you tried a face to face grief support group?

I found that it really helped but there are several different kinds. The one I did best with happened to mainly be other widows and widowers so they had gone through/were going through a lot of the same things I was. We could bounce things off of each other. Even the others who had lost a different loved one helped a lot because some parts of grief are the same no matter what.

I hope you continue to come here and that someone will give you what you are looking for. I have to agree with Kath that by not letting us OLDIES help you that you are doing yourself a disservice but if that is what you want then so be it. Each person's grief is their own and they have to handle it in their own way.

[Ron B.]

Debbie,

I find myself distracted by anger towards people who have in some way slighted me. And then I read a post like yours and the anger washes away. It's the sheer kind words of others that keep me afloat at all. I'm trying to figure out how to keep so much negative emotion at bay. It reminds me of a yard full of weeds. Lop off the tops and they just keep coming back. I'm pretty sure I don't need a massive dose of weed killer, sprinkling it on all the things and people that wreck havoc in my life. That would be too toxic, and kill the plants I want to keep. Probably kill me as well. The cure is in the thoughtful parsing of each little root of negative emotion, very carefully removing it from the ground and from my life. Without forgiveness and kindness I don't have the strength to even look at all the weeds. I have anger towards my former employer, who slashed my job, even though my evaluations were exemplary. Towards my sister, who locked me out of the family home over the Christmas holidays. Toward reckless drivers who almost hit me with their cars (I go everywhere on a bicycle). One driver actually did hit me, and now he wants me to sign legal forms, else he won't pay for the damage to my bicycle. I even have mild anger towards Marty in this forum. I think about Marty, what a busybody and know-it-all! And yet I realize she created this sandbox we all play in, and the healing she has fostered is immeasurable. I sometimes swear at people under my breath, particularly when in traffic. Moron! That's my favorite swear word. I know I need to root out this sort of behavior from my character. I know I need to be more tolerant and forgiving. I feel so petty sometimes. I see so many things going south in my life, and it's only good people and their kindness, that give me any clear guidance at all.

Thank you for your posts.

Ron B.

[Ron B.]

Kath,

I can not relate to anything you wrote in your post. At all. Please stop dog-piling on me about Marty. I have the right to choose my friends, and whom I interact with.

Ron B.

[Ron B.]

mlg,

Please give the subject of my relationship to Marty a complete rest. That is my business, not yours. It is up to Marty and I to resolve our differences.

The rest of your post gets through to me. I realize I was very lucky in spending quality time with my Mom before she passed. Her last words were a mantra that she kept repeating over and over again until she lost consciousness. She left this life repeating, "I love you, I love you, I love you", over and over again until she was gone. I was with her when she died, and this experience has changed me forever.

I grieved when I lost my father in 2002, but nothing like I'm grieving now over the loss of my mother. I wonder why. I think the death a mother is intrinsically more devastating, but I'm only guessing that's the case.

To be honest, I have no comprehension at all of what it means to lose a husband or a wife. You see, I have been single all my life, and never once been in a long term relationship. That's my poverty, I know. I'm trying to correct that and find the richness of a shared life. So, you see, your grief is foreign territory for me, but I'm trying to understand it.

As for group counseling, funny you should ask about that, since I have been trying to line that up. The problem is that I constantly travel back and forth between my mother's home in Southern California and my residence in the San Francisco Bay Area. Moreover, the group counseling I'm looking for would best be with my siblings, although I would settle for group counseling with complete strangers.

Ron B.

[derby]

Ron,

As I have said in an earlier post, you have a wonderful gift with words and expression of what you are feeling. I don't know what your career was before you took time off to care for your beloved Mother, but having such a gift with words, could prove to be an area in which you could excel. If you so desire. Pen to paper. Feelings that make no sense at the time, written down even if jumbled. I wish I could get my son to do this, but...he won't. My son as well was not employed while we went through the dying process with his Dad. As I look back, it turned out to be such a blessing. He then had the time to devote to his Dad. Time he could not otherwise have taken. And it would anger me that my employer would have dis-regared the time off I needed to be with my loved one. I can see and feel the anger my son carries in his heart and soul. And then moments of tears when he allows the pain to surface. I never know what to do or say to him as I have not yet lost a parent. I have lost a sister and I have lost my husband. I have lost friends, friends not through death, but from the changes in my heart. Changes that have made me view life in a very different way then I did before. I no longer have the tolerance for some of the opinions of where they think I should be in this process and how I am traveling through this process. I am very, very picky with whom I spend my time with. What I need, some of them just don't understand or the words they say cut me to the core. Ron, once again, I wish I had the insight to offer you just the right words, as I wish I did for my son. I can say we are all here to offer support and understanding and kindness. And someday, maybe as I browse through a bookstore, I will see a book written by RonB. You never know Ron what miricles or surprises life has instore for us. Blessings to you Ron and I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers. Reading your posts has given me insight to what my son may be feeling and I will so try to keep my heart and mind open to what he may need from me. To what he may not be sharing verbally with me, but whats really in his heart. Peace and comfort to you RonB. Debbie

[Babs11]

OK EVERYONE,

I can see that as far I have been on this site (not that long 5mos)..This is the first Family Quarrel...

I can see both sides to this issue..just like I always do and just like I did when my Husband and I were having a debate..I am going to keep Personal feelings out of this...

..If your needs are not being met then Ron you need to find a site or a group where they will..I spare my feelings here openly and look for love and encouragement and a kind word or just to have someone who has the "littlest" idea of how I feel and understand How Big My Love is and respond back..I try to offer Humor, Love and the Best to my entries because I sincerely mean them and the Pain that I feel is not anything that I wish on anyone..If I am having a bad day..It the stress, loneliness, financial, having to be Mom and Dad now...to a 18 yr old Son who graduates this year and will be going to college gets to me and I am sad..I have the right to be "Depressed and Low" and it doesn't mean I am not a POSITIVE PERSON...If I have to try to fill the void of every conversation with his "Son" that said..."I LOVE YOU SON".or His Multiple times a day said.."HI, Pal"..or the card I found right after he Passed that declared His Unconditional Love for our Son..(and I will post it because it is the most beautiful card I've read)..Unfortunately, Grief is not Pretty or at times Hopeful and certainly not Peaceful ..

That is why it is called the "Grim Reaper" and it turns the most BEAUTIFUL people into something Unknown...

Forums are for people to express themselves Good, Bad and Indifferent and Unfortunately not everyday we feel like writing an inspiring POEM or a Telling the World that "THE GRASS IS GREENER ON THE OTHER SIDE" this is Grief and

and you know what......"IT STINKS"...and the saying, "S____s's to Be You...You Got that Right..

Love and Peace,

Let's try to understand one another better..We were given the Strength to Reach Out.

Babs.

[leeann]

Hi Ron.. I have lost both parents now. Just passed the 3 year anniversary for my Mom's passing and I am coming up on 8 years for my Dad.

And I bet I have cried more this year than any other previous year. Hurts to the core. Many days I feel rudderless.... aimless...just flippin lost.. and I fail to find my footing.

Yeah I am married and I have two kids. They have been very understanding and we all kind of talk about grief out loud together when we are having bad moments. That helps.. but.. nothing.. nothing I have found takes the pain away.

I just have had to learn to live in pain.

Sometimes that means I am angry... alot of the time. I hear ya on the problem you have with calling people "moron" etc. I too seem to have halved (or more) my amount of patience in others' and sometimes with myself. And.. I have learned that anger.. that impatience... that anger is just part of it. And I am trying to live the best I can with it and trying to express it in a healthier manner. Like that gal in the movie... typing like mad while sitting next to Geo Clooney.. saying she was typing "with purpose". Yeah.. well... I'm living WITH that same 'purpose' because sometimes I don't have a grip on what mine is anymore. I know I am wife and Mom.. but ya know.. no one needs me anymore. My folks did. I have no close girl friends and the 'friends' I did have when these deaths happened... are no more.. we have grown apart. My Mom was my best friend... we talked nearly everyday. That connection... is just g-o-n-e.... and that just a-c-h-e-s... still.

My parents and I and my family here (hub & kids) were real close. We saw each other every weekend. They were a HUGE part of our lives. And now.. they are gone. So is the only home I ever knew til I got married and that Mom & Dad lived in for 50 & 45 years respectively. "Home" is gone.. just gone. Like I was this sailboat and someone cut my anchor. Ya know?

And yeah this is.. "years" down this road of grief. So the pain... the missing.. that kinda continues .. in layers.. like an onion. I see, feel & express one layer... only to discover yet another.... and on and on and on....

Ya know what?? I don't think there IS an end that I can see to the grieving process. I really don't know.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

What have I learned???? Oh my.. what HAVEN'T I learned! I have learned... I was loved.. REALLY REALLY well. And that I loved REALLY well in return. I have learned I was SO blessed to have the parents I had. I have learned what it feels like to run out of tears. I have learned that sometimes... there seems to be an unending supply of them.

I have learned I can do more... bear more.... feel & express more than I ever thought possible.

I have learned... I don't know much.

I have learned about different kinds of love... different layers of living.

I have learned that death... loss... is a great teacher.

And I have learned I am changed because of death & loss & grief. I am a different person than I was 8 years ago.

I don't know Ron it's a WILD ride.... and I am just hanging on. Cuz sometimes it's so fast and at other times achingly slow. Still at yet other times... real real REAL rough... chock full of pot holes... turned ankles & flat tires. And other times it is so bittersweet, one's tears fall upon a wistful smile.

I have wrinkles where I didn't used to.. There are caverns under my eyes.. I'm softer as in I just have more fat... yet man... I'm tough... REAL tough... too. I live edgier than I ever have and I am living a whole lot messier than I ever have as well.

This is just me now... today...

Tomorrow??? I have no idea... today is already plenty for me to handle.

Welcome to the Club Ron. Sorry you had to join... but I am sure you can understand that I am also glad to have one more person who just "gets it".

[Ron B.]

Babs,

You say,

"If your needs are not being met then Ron you need to find a site or a group where they will"

Babs, I have found very soulful communication in this forum, and it has helped me with my grief. I like it here, and I intend to stay.

I hope no one here makes you feel unwelcome. Because that would be hurtful, and we all have enough pain. I am trying to understand your grief, but so far I don't get it at all. I'll go digging now into your past posts. Just maybe I'll be able to grasp something of the human being you are and the loss you have endured.

Ron B.

[Korina]

Ron:

When my husband, Scott, died just over 7 months ago, the words that kept coming to mind were, "This sucks donkeys.", and "I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy." This journey sucks big time, but, like you, I have found much comfort from this forum.

Interesting observation about your anger. I have actually found that my anger has muted. I guess we all react in our own ways. Pretty much I seem to think of all the other challenges in my life right now as minor compared to losing Scott, and the fact that he no longer has the opportunity to watch his daughter grow up (or, more specifically, to watch her grow up with me, as I imagine he can see pretty much everything from where he is now). About that, I am mad. But the other things are just annoyances. If I can survive Scott's death, the rest is "whatever". But I have to add that I have been blessed with amazing support from friends, family and my inlaws.

I hope you continue to find solace here.

Korina

[Ron B.]

leeann,

I am a bit stunned by the power of what you have written. You fully answered my questions about the duration of grieving and what's learned through grieving. Very difficult questions. Very good answers. Thank you.

By the way, I have a LeighAnn in my family. Same name, just spelled differently.

Ron B.

[Daughter2010]

Talking about grief coming in layers, that may be so very true. One moment you are OK and two hours later crying uncontrollably. I don't know if there is an end to this process because from what others have said, the pain of losing their loved ones resurfaces at different times in their lives. I remember asking myself the "how long will I be feeling like this" only 3 days after my father passed. We are experiencing grief in different ways according to our own experiences with our loved ones, the type of bond we had, or the one we wished we had, our own personality, etc....in other words..they way I experience my grief is different than yours Ron, or from Babs, or Leeann....but it sure feels good to know that I can express these thoughts here and there are people who can understand or relate, because they too have lost a loved one.

It is true that death and loss makes us more aware of who we are and it completely changes us. It made me face my own mortality, and how this life is so short...today I can be here typing, tomorrow I can be gone.

Just yesterday morning, I had talked to someone I hadn't seen in a long time, he had asked me how my dad was doing and I told him of his passing, in a very calm way. But later at night, going through some my stuff and cleaning, I found some pics of my and dad from last year, when he was ok and when his health started to decay, pictures from family gatherings and stuff. I could not help it but to start crying uncontrollably. Crying the same exact way as when I was 6yrs old and was waiting for my dad to pick me up from school and he was late.

Only three months have passed, but it is ok to have these moments. It is part of feeling the pain. It sure has made me a different person.

I just wanted to express this. Thank you all for reading. Have a good day and look for the bright spots in it... :-)

-L