Crying

[nashreed]

I have thought about the act of, and the purpose of crying for a while now. A year after Annette's passing, and I still don't think I ever had a really good "cry" about the loss. Why? I thought that it was an emotional deficiency on my part. Why was I not able to cry and grieve? Did I not really, deep down, love her enough? Certainly I loved her more than anyone could ever love anyone. Was it too soon, would it take time? When I first lost her, there were tears, but not a "classic" crying jag. I know I'm not supposed to judge my way of grieving against others, but I felt so strongly that I was doing her memory a disservice by not being a bundle of sobs. Surely, she deserved a bawling, no holds barred Tear-a-palooza.

Just yesterday, I had the memory of when she would cry. She would often cry- from frustration at her circumstance, from her chronic pain, as a release. I hated to see her cry and could not deal with it. I knew it was healthy for her to get it out, but to me it was a reaction of my not having done enough for her, to where crying was the only outlet. Was my reassurance not enough? My comfort inadequate? Inevitably, after crying for a bit, she would get stuffed up and couldn't breathe, and her throat would start hurting- it takes a lot out of you physically. I would always joke with her, "She what you did, you cried and now you can't breathe"- just so that she wouldn't cry anymore. She would say "I know, but I had to get it out". Subconsciously, I think I have blocked myself from being able to have that release- knowing that it will not only physically "choke me up". mess up my throat, make it hard to breathe...It's uncomfortable, and being a selfish and practical person, I don't want to cause myself discomfort, do I? I think Annette understands (I hope) that my not being able to cry is because it make me so upset to see her cry, and its actually a testament to her and I certainly don't want her to see me cry from up in Heaven. I'm ok if she's ok. 

I have feelings of depression, loss, rage, hopelessness every day. I get my emotions out in other ways. In the practical sense, has anyone here found a way that works for them to, not suppress crying, but an outlet that is a healthy alternative? I think my music and my love for her and knowing that she worries about me up there allow me to feel that crying is not necessary- at least for me. Y'know, she's good up there. What do I have to cry about? I'll see her again. 

James

 

[Gwenivere]

I think you asked and answered your own question.  We love know grief takes many forms.  I’m in a place I desperately want to cry but can’t. It’s very frustrating as I think I would feel better.  I usually do.  I had a chance a counselor yesterday and I’m putting up some blocks I don’t understand.  Hoping to try and chip at them today in another session.  
 

Crying isn’t proof of love, commitment, pain or anything associated with it.  It’s more natural for some, not for others.  You know she is fine now.  You will be with her again.  It sustains your soul.  You knew her and that she understood you so would she be surprised at this?   For your commitment to each other and deep connection, I don’t think so.  She knew you better than anyone.  I think if Steve could see the gut wrenching melt fiend I’ve had it would make him very sad, knowing he was the cause.  But he also knew me and that is how I react to emotional pain.  I would cry after dropping my best friend at the airport after visiting. 
 

your music is a healthy alternative.  It sustains you.  Anything we do that can ease any of the pain is healthy.  Barring hurting others of course.   You are comparing yourself to others and that isn’t healthy.  If I did that I’d fall short in areas snd be odd in others.   We all have our own paths, no news there.  But we do share the bond.  It’s good you asked.  I hope you see you’ve known al along.  And who’d not to say one day you won’t cry and it will be exactly what you need?  

[nashreed]

Yeah, I didn't mean to answer my own question, as much as I wanted to verbalize the thought to be able to process it- as we all do here. I am just kind of fascinated by the act of crying- how it helped Annette. I never understood the NEED she had to do it. I always thought that it was a failing of mine and that if I was doing my job, she wouldn't need to cry. I know, of course, that I couldn't solve everything. 

Crying is such an emotional release, and a good one for the cryer, but so hard to witness for the other partner. 

Annette was the kind of person that would have been fascinated by the "process" of grieving. She always wanted to be a psychologist. 

[HG88]

If you were raised with belief in afterlife and have actively believed it throughout your life, I can see why you would not cry over loved ones passing. If my loved one goes on vacation, I'm happy for them, and happy for me. I don't mourn them, I don't feel bad to live myself. I don't feel eternally cut off from them or their love. They're just in a different location. If they called and said "yeah, we're actually just gonna stay here, maybe you can come one day" I would be like oh...ok. 

If someone kidnapped my cat, but left a note saying "I have kidnapped your cat, there is nothing you can do to find her or me, I covered every possible track so don't even bother. But, relax, I just wanted your kitty, I'll take great care of her and she has already met and fell in love with my kids and our puppy! She is loving it!" I don't think i'd cry either, I'd be pissed someone took my damn cat lol but then go well if she is happy and making them happy I'm ok with not having her anymore myself. 

But yes when I think from the "default assumption" as i was raised, that we are just the body which died so our consciousnes which was a function of the body simply stops functioning forever and death is nonexistence, just nothing, not anything at all, no mind or consciousness to be having experiences etc -  then death does feel very sad. Someone so vividly real, vibrant, brimming with life and personality and awareness and sense of self and sense of self in relationships with other selves (other people), all that just *poof* turns off, done and gone forever, all their love, hate, whatever just out like a candle blown. Eapecially sudden untimely deaths, makes life seem like a sick joke, that we all just live until some random thing wipes us out and all that we lived and worked for is just left hanging in suspence forever peft incomplete by our sudden death... what is that? I think in a way the devastating emotions this view of life and death can induce might be a proof of how wrong it is. And maybe your lack of ability to cry, is due to having the more right belief that there is afterlife, only bodies are dying, souls are fine. I mean why would you cry? I get in a car accident, car is totalled, I happen to have escaped without a scratch! ad family member, do you cry or celebrate? if people die physically and spiritually go to heaven, why cry? why not celebrate? it completely changes the whole thing to me, then really the only sadness is waiting till it's your time, and that could also be spun into an excited anticipation that energizes and motivates while still living. 

Personally, I can cry. I could EASILY not cry, but for me that would mean being an asshole, being indifferent to it and ignoring it, because my default assumption is still (even though i hate it) that death is the end, due to how i was raised with that implicit belief, so death is sad, i feel the loss not only as temporary but forever, they are forever separated from me by dying, because the only chance of knowing them is one living being to another. 

 

I don't believe in an enthusiastic way there is nothing after death, i try not to believe it, but it seems to sit there sullenly like a big boulder and won't budge at all even though i try to move it. 

 

so ienvitably when i start dwelling on the thoughts of the loved one, a sadness arises, i picture them so tender and vulnerable, at their time of greatest need, dying, their whole physical system failing and me helplessly watching them die unable to help, and then i feel how beautiful and loving and just amazing they were in every way, it all seems to profound juat how incredible they were, their life was (keyword: was), and how empty life feels now for me without them. I will get teary here and then decide if I should stop or go further into it. But to stop at all seems wrong, feels wrong, feels like I'm choosing to be shallow and not care, when i do care and do want to dwell on it all. Idkis it worse to suffer the sadness or worse to be indifferent to it? it doesnt feel bad being indifferent to it in the moment, it feels bad upon reflection because then i'm meta-analyzing it all from these different levels, caring, not caring, dwelling, not dwelling, why am i caring or not caring etc. 

 

i also cry due to a feeling of guilt that i let them down or even when they were healthy did not appreciate them, ignored them, etc, because now i see how wonderful they were and wish i could redo my life and love them more and live life more with them together. I chose to be so selfish and selfinvolved my whole life, I hate myself for it. I honestly have a profoundly strong need to die, I generally hope I will die from various causes soon, and at some point each day you might find me privately begging God to kill me right now or let me die. I've used drugs and alcohol for years and I hope they have destroyed my inner organs so my lifespan is greatly reduced. I don't even get enjoyment or anying from them anymire, I just do it to die sooner. I know, sounds weird but true. 

 

And i cry because i feel like i lost that beautiful love, but forever. part of me just never fully buys it that there's an afterlife. i feel crazy when I do try to believe it especially because I hop right over into believing ever paranormal thing ever like ghosts etc. and it feels like why even live anymore? life has just been sucked dry of the mist important love for me, what is remaining? and it feels so bleak. so the crying is sometimes more for myself, like sad for myself. and that then involves overall life sadness, sad how my life turned out, that i got addicted to drugs and developed substance abuse disorder etc. sad life went that way when i had a normal childhood overall. it is not always this noble crying entirely for the lost Other, sadly, sometimes it is a selfish sorta cry. 

Nashreed, you don't need to respond to my post, i am sorta talking to you but also using it to process my own thoughts 

 

 

 

[HG88]

maybe also, you believe she still exists in heaven and fully "gets" you and how you are living without her. Maybe she beams love down on you 24/7 or something, but if you believed she was gone forever, and she was the only person to ever really love you, maybe you'd want to cry for yourself, that you lost that source of love. 

 

One problem I have is, I feel like no one really loves me at all, only my cat did. I used to say my grandma did, but I think her love was conditional and not really what i would consider total, full, perfect love. She would get mad at me, pick arguments, turn against me, etc in life, try to control me, that isn't love to me. if she loved, it was a possessive love due to thinkin she had to care for me because i was part of her group of people in her life, but my cat just loved me whole, did not pick and choose, turn against me. She never did aything to limit my growth as  a person, to stop me from living life, she never tried to control me (yea, i know cats are in a way controlling lol but i don't mean like that). she accepted me at all times, all states of mind, health, etc. i really feel my cat Althea had the most beautiful sense of love in her heart, i think she liked and remembered fondly everyone else in her life too, but she loved me deeply in a powerful way, i had taken her round to say goodbye to her original family next door, she would have the, imprinted on her mind as a kitten yknow, all that, yet still just showed a sort of basic like for them, it was like oh "hi, original family, i guess hg88 has brought me here to inform you i am dying, see ya later, ps you guys are alright, but now let me get back to beaming love to hg88 because hes my main guy no offense lol". They knew it too and always said it long before she died, how she loved me so much. 

stuff like that then makes me cry almost like tears of joy, remembering how wonderful that was, that she did that for me, we met and she liked me so much, she chose me to be her main person, most beloved. it is such an honor! wow. so the tears here now are like beautiful feeling, sad and poingant but not in that dreary depressing way, it's like suddenly feeling full of meaningfulness and deepness of life experiences. enriched by love from my cat. 

 

it's interesting how you used to react to your wife crying. i am the opposite, if i see family crying or upset, i dont do anyhing, i basically get out of their way and leave them too it, maybe because i am able to cry myself, i know i dont need someone telling me stupid things or jokes or even well meaning advice to stop me crying, its like no... i want to do this, its all part of it, i literally dont want to just be flat and dry and emotionless about it, this person was so much to me, i want gothru the intense emotions of it, it feels like a testament to how intense their love was. but that's me, i think you are just different so it's not wrong for you not to cry, you believe she is in heaven waiting. she is "on vacation", that's all. 

I remmeber when i was 7, my mothers father died. i was out playin with friends, my father came to tell me. he seemed sad, he liked my mothers father and had known him long time. but i was like oh... and went to the abthroom and looked at my face all serious and then pulled a silly face and laughed at it all, lauged that he died or that everyone was all sad, i'm not sure anymire. I liked him, had nothing against him etc, so idk why I didn't care at all and thought them being sad was weird and funny. I knew i had to pretend to be sad, but i wasnt. (Geez dont i paint a picture of myself like Burke Ramsey? LOL)

 

 

 

 

 

[nashreed]

HG88,

I hope that my thread idea absolutely helped you. If you were able to make some sense out of your reasons for crying, then that was the point of my post. 

I have felt all the feelings you described in your posts in my own life, with my own circumstances. My grandmother died when I was 8. I didn't cry for her. I didn't feel bad- she was kinda mean. My Mom didn't cry in front of me. I was raised in an emotionally repressed household. 

When I met Annette, not only did she come in with beautiful hugs and love, she came in with a capacity to cry and was so in touch with her emotions- she was not afraid of them like I am. If I really stopped and thought long enough about the loss of her physical body- her perfect little nose that I could press in like a button, her cute little ears, I might cry and never stop. There's a difference between crying and shedding a tear. I am shedding a tear right now. 

But love, our love, is still alive. It is stronger than death. I can feel it in the mornings, when I look at the sky, in the funny little birds, its there. And I truly don't want her to see me cry (just like my Mom didn't cry in front of me). I think Annette feels sadness that she had to go. I have to be strong. I know that we will be together again. ALL of us will be with our loved ones again. There IS an afterlife. My belief in that is why I don't need to cry. Annette believed in it and she was never wrong. She knew she wouldn't live a long life, and she didn't fear death. She knew there was already a place for her in Heaven. I'd be nice for us to all meet up there someday, in spirit. 

[kayc]

21 hours ago, nashreed said:

Why was I not able to cry and grieve?

Tears are NOT a measurement of how much we love someone, neither is how we grieve.  A lot of factors influence our grief...our shock, our own coping ability, support system, how we handle our emotions, etc.  I have a friend who lost her husband of 50 years several years ago...she still has yet to cry.  She is not holding back, it just hasn't happened.  I told her not to worry about it.  I know she misses him.  it seems that tears can be a release valve on a pressure cooker, but not everyone cries.  As long as you're not purposely trying to hold it in, please don't worry, you don't need to conjure them up in order to "do this right."  There is no right or wrong way, only our way.  The only thing I'd caution someone against, although I understand well, would be turning to unhealthy means of coping such as drinking/drugs, stuffing our emotions.  One person came here a few years ago and it had been over 20 years since he'd lost his fiance...he's now married with a family and all of a sudden his grief hit him!  It can do that, lay in wait for years, until we're more ready to deal with it, but it doesn't just go away if we hold it inside.  You, my friend, are not one to hold it in and stuff it. 

This is an interesting article on crying in grief:  I didn't have to dose mine, it was just there, unbidden.  Dosing Crying Time in Grief

[kayc]

17 hours ago, Gwenivere said:

Crying isn’t proof of love, commitment, pain or anything associated with it.  It’s more natural for some, not for others.  You know she is fine now.  You will be with her again.  It sustains your soul.

So aptly stated!  

[nashreed]

I was watching the terrible story on the news about the wife of one of the San Jose victims. Her husband was near death and crying and reached for her hand. it really hit me hard. Annette had a tear in her eye when I saw her at the hospital after she had passed. I actually asked about it, and they said that it was normal to release tears when passing, not from sadness, but just as a bodily function. 

I wonder though... I feel so bad that I wasn't there the moment she passed. She was still alive when they took her that night. Was she sad that I wasn't there? Was she in pain because they might have broken some ribs when doing CPR, trying to get her back. So many questions. I just can't think about it too much, but its good to release it into the internet. Maybe it will help free me from the guilt and sadness, a post at a time.

[Gwenivere]

I hope it does help the guilt you keep carrying.  I can tell you til I’m blue in the face I know you did all you could and need to drop that burden.   But until it comes from in you, it won’t matter.  I’ve reread many of your posts and see the most caring man to her.  Maybe you can let Annette tell you to put that aside as she is waiting to see you again and if she had any doubts of your love, she wouldn’t be as anxious to see you again.  I just try and remember what my grief counselor and therapist told me about negative thoughts.  If we feed ourselves with them all the time, we will come to believe them.  I’m more careful of words I ascribe to myself now.  Like I instead of stupid, I’ll say momentarily unwise.  Stuff like that.  Or frustrated instead of mean.  Humanize myself.  Be imperfect like everyone like I allow them.   

[kayc]

I googled this subject and it said sometimes tears are released as a reflex (not as indication of sadness).  Lacrima mortis affects 14% of dying patients.

[nashreed]

51 minutes ago, kayc said:

I googled this subject and it said sometimes tears are released as a reflex (not as indication of sadness).  Lacrima mortis affects 14% of dying patients.

That's comforting. I wiped it away and kissed her forehead and that's the last thing I could do for her.

[kayc]

[Larrylifelines]

A couple of days after my wife's death, I knew I needed to let my grief out in a big way. So I got in my car and drove to a secluded spot a couple of miles away. I parked the car, rolled up the windows, and with no effort at all, began to sob. I did that for, I don't know, maybe 20 or 30 minutes--until I felt a genuine release. I was hoping that would happen, because my grief was profound and disabling. In the three months since then, I have not (no one in this forum will be surprised to learn) overcome my grief; it's with me every day, and I start crying again at unpredictable times and with unexplainable triggers. 

I never try to stop the crying. It's part of who I am now, and it belongs there. In my current partner-less life, it's easy to do my crying away from other people. And that's OK. I still feel that crying is part of the process that will eventually restore a measure of happiness to my life, so I welcome it.

But I also look forward to that day when even a familiar movie or song, a distant memory, the sight of her picture--that those triggers will elicit nothing more than a fond remembrance, and I'll be ready to once again be truly happy. 

I ain't there yet, though. I really miss that woman.

[nashreed]

That's very sweet. It's a good attitude to have about crying. I'm from an emotionally stunted family. I wish crying was easy. I could use the release. 

I'm lucky that I do have moments where I think of a "Nettie-ism", something funny or cute that Annette would say, and it brings a smile. Just as often though, I will get depressed from something on TV, or a song. It's a roller coaster.

[kayc]

16 hours ago, Larrylifelines said:

A couple of days after my wife's death, I knew I needed to let my grief out in a big way. So I got in my car and drove to a secluded spot a couple of miles away. I parked the car, rolled up the windows, and with no effort at all, began to sob. I did that for, I don't know, maybe 20 or 30 minutes--until I felt a genuine release. I was hoping that would happen, because my grief was profound and disabling. In the three months since then, I have not (no one in this forum will be surprised to learn) overcome my grief; it's with me every day, and I start crying again at unpredictable times and with unexplainable triggers. 

I never try to stop the crying. It's part of who I am now, and it belongs there. In my current partner-less life, it's easy to do my crying away from other people. And that's OK. I still feel that crying is part of the process that will eventually restore a measure of happiness to my life, so I welcome it.

But I also look forward to that day when even a familiar movie or song, a distant memory, the sight of her picture--that those triggers will elicit nothing more than a fond remembrance, and I'll be ready to once again be truly happy. 

I ain't there yet, though. I really miss that woman.

I am so sorry that yet another person has to suffer this loss, it's profound, I know.  I bawled for I don't know how long, but gradually over the years the tears dried up and I carry my grief inside of me, I have learned to co-exist with it.  It's like I cried out all of my tears, I even have to use artificial tears in my eyes now on a regular basis.  
We welcome you here and encourage you to read/post any time you feel like it.  If you notice our Vent and Hell threads, they're more about letting out what we would have with our partners but no one is here to listen now.    Just ordinary days in the lives of widows/widowers.  It's a different life, for sure.  Growing old alone.

 

I want to share an article I wrote of the things I've found helpful over the years, in the hopes something will be of help to you either now or on down the road.

TIPS TO MAKE YOUR WAY THROUGH GRIEF

There's no way to sum up how to go on in a simple easy answer, but I encourage you to read the other threads here, little by little you will learn how to make your way through this.  I do want to give you some pointers though, of some things I've learned on my journey.

• Take one day at a time.  The Bible says each day has enough trouble of it's own, I've found that to be true, so don't bite off more than you can chew.  It can be challenging enough just to tackle today.  I tell myself, I only have to get through today.  Then I get up tomorrow and do it all over again.  To think about the "rest of my life" invites anxiety.
• Don't be afraid, grief may not end but it evolves.  The intensity lessens eventually.
• Visit your doctor.  Tell them about your loss, any troubles sleeping, suicidal thoughts, anxiety attacks.  They need to know these things in order to help you through it...this is all part of grief.
• Suicidal thoughts are common in early grief.  If they're reoccurring, call a suicide hotline.  I felt that way early on, but then realized it wasn't that I wanted to die so much as I didn't want to go through what I'd have to face if I lived.  Back to taking a day at a time.  Suicide Hotline - Call 1-800-273-8255 or www.crisis textline.org or US and Canada: text 741741 UK: text 85258 | Ireland: text 50808
• Give yourself permission to smile.  It is not our grief that binds us to them, but our love, and that continues still.
• Try not to isolate too much.  
• There's a balance to reach between taking time to process our grief, and avoiding it...it's good to find that balance for yourself.  We can't keep so busy as to avoid our grief, it has a way of haunting us, finding us, and demanding we pay attention to it!  Some people set aside time every day to grieve.  I didn't have to, it searched and found me!
• Self-care is extremely important, more so than ever.  That person that would have cared for you is gone, now you're it...learn to be your own best friend, your own advocate, practice self-care.  You'll need it more than ever.
• Recognize that your doctor isn't trained in grief, find a professional grief counselor that is.  We need help finding ourselves through this maze of grief, knowing where to start, etc.  They have not only the knowledge, but the resources.
• In time, consider a grief support group.  If your friends have not been through it themselves, they may not understand what you're going through, it helps to find someone somewhere who DOES "get it". 
• Be patient, give yourself time.  There's no hurry or timetable about cleaning out belongings, etc.  They can wait, you can take a year, ten years, or never deal with it.  It's okay, it's what YOU are comfortable with that matters.  
• Know that what we are comfortable with may change from time to time.  That first couple of years I put his pictures up, took them down, up, down, depending on whether it made me feel better or worse.  Finally, they were up to stay.
• Consider a pet.  Not everyone is a pet fan, but I've found that my dog helps immensely.  It's someone to love, someone to come home to, someone happy to see me, someone that gives me a purpose...I have to come home and feed him.  Besides, they're known to relieve stress.  Well maybe not in the puppy stage when they're chewing up everything, but there's older ones to adopt if you don't relish that stage.
• Make yourself get out now and then.  You may not feel interest in anything, things that interested you before seem to feel flat now.  That's normal.  Push yourself out of your comfort zone just a wee bit now and then.  Eating out alone, going to a movie alone or church alone, all of these things are hard to do at first.  You may feel you flunked at it, cried throughout, that's okay, you did it, you tried, and eventually you get a little better at it.  If I waited until I had someone to do things with I'd be stuck at home a lot.
• Keep coming here.  We've been through it and we're all going through this together.
• Look for joy in every day.  It will be hard to find at first, but in practicing this, it will change your focus so you can embrace what IS rather than merely focusing on what ISN'T.  It teaches you to live in the present and appreciate fully.  You have lost your big joy in life, and all other small joys may seem insignificant in comparison, but rather than compare what used to be to what is, learn the ability to appreciate each and every small thing that comes your way...a rainbow, a phone call from a friend, unexpected money, a stranger smiling at you, whatever the small joy, embrace it.  It's an art that takes practice and is life changing if you continue it.
• Eventually consider volunteering.  It helps us when we're outward focused, it's a win/win.

(((hugs))) Praying for you today.

[Gwenivere]

21 hours ago, Larrylifelines said:

But I also look forward to that day when even a familiar movie or song, a distant memory, the sight of her picture--that those triggers will elicit nothing more than a fond remembrance, and I'll be ready to once again be truly happy. 

I don’t know if we all will be truly happy again, but for most it gets better.  Those triggers will be around for a long time this being so much a shock reaction and the hardest time of feeling so alone.  Too many daily things you haven’t adjusted to yet.  We tweak and change things as we travel this road, but it’s overshadowed by what we had when those memories were being made.  Sometimes it seems a dream Steve existed.  Others times it was like yesterday.  I chose to avoid obvious triggers til I could face them better.  No music, I could actually blind myself to his face in pictures, try and drown out his voice, but that was mostly unsuccessful.  It was and is the silence that gets to me now, 6 years in.  No greetings, discussions, jokes or any sound of his physically being here.  Doors opening and closing, him on the phone with buddies, singing little ditties.  My head is full of commercial jingles that I never knew would have existed as I didn’t have the TV on so much.  
 

Crying is good.  I wish I did more now.  Like Kay said, I wonder if I cried myself out.  I’ll cry talking to my doctors snd counselors.  Don’t around acquaintances anymore.  They’ve moved on which is normal.  I just wasn’t expecting being left so isolated in it.  That is why I sought out this group and attend a virtual one.  When that ends I’m hoping they continue some meetings as they are so helpful interactively.  Anyway, cry all you want and can.  I would have spells called 'keening' which I couldn’t talk and barely breathe.  Pound the walls and scream.  You aren’t alone in that need.  We can’t outrun grief.  I had to accept I had a new entity in my life I don’t want.  I still can’t do music, but I can look at his picture and occasionally talk to him.  They say someone is alive as long as they are not forgotten.

[kayc]

If I pounded the walls here they would probably break!  But I did drive out in the woods and screamed at the top of my lungs, probably scared some bear and cougar.