Annette

[V. R.]

9 hours ago, nashreed said:

want to have someone alive and real who understands me, who cares about me- not the "me" that someone wants me to be. Annette was that. I will never have that again in this life. I jus

This part of your post particularly hit me. I have this feeling,too. Before I met my husband, I was also a bit of a 'negative' person, silent, timid, having difficulty socialising, feeling embarrassed when finding myself in groups of people making conversation,and so on. My husband was the exact opposite, he was a born 'converser', always found the right words to express emotions, knew how to handle difficult situations, solved all problems, could speak in front of a crowd of people, and much more. He gave me confidence in myself, broadened  my horizons, as they say, made me a 'better person', literally made me come out of my shell, and be able to confront any life issues, which I wouldn't have done without his encouragement. All this fortunately still lives in me, but I feel I will lose it all gradually and end up being worse than I was before. 

Your love for Annette will always be with you James, remember that she wouldn't want you to feel like this, I know it's easier said than done by try to get through your days knowing that  she still loves you and always will. Cherish this in a precious way, feel superior to others, don't feel annoyed if they don't understand, they can't but we can.  

[kayc]

17 hours ago, Gwenivere said:

I wish I could see you put that energy into ways to find value in yourself.

Gwen, I'm glad you didn't delete your response because it shows insight and I agree...

James, I wish so much we could do it for you, show you how valuable you are!  But alas it's something only we can do for ourselves, it comes from within and it takes concerted effort...to forgive our own shortcomings (we all have them), to exemplify VALUE to ourselves and see our good points!  Loving ourselves is our first step.

[kayc]

10 hours ago, razorclam said:

ou did the right thing by making Annette happy, whether with CDs or chocolate eggs.

My sister also had a sweet tooth (diabetic also), so am I to be faulted now that she's dead because I let her have dessert?  She's a grown ass woman who made her own choices and it is not my place to rule her, even if disabled, even if in her "best interest!"  Who of us gets to determine what is in someone else's best interest?!  Doctors?  Family?  God?  No, even God values freedom of choice, that's why He gave it to us.  He prefers we FREELY come to Him, choose Him, even at the expense of knowing some of us will not.  He never made us puppets, He does not take on the role of puppeteer!  It's okay she had a Cadbury.  I love them too!  I choose NOT to eat them for my health, but that's my CHOICE, no one is pushing that on me!

You were great with Annette, and she with you, same as George and I were, thank God we had them in our lives for whatever time we got!

[Roxi]

Oh Kay i’m so sorry for tour loss...life is truly unpredictable!

A huge hug Roxi

[nashreed]

15 hours ago, razorclam said:

 You did the right thing by making Annette happy, whether with CDs or chocolate eggs.

 Less than a week before my friend died he sent me a long middle of the night text cataloging his favorite (non-alcoholic) drinks (e. g., fruit and rice-milk based smoothies). He barely ate anything for the last month of his life, and I am sure he was suffering to some extent from malnutrition. His last weekend he sent out for a horchata (over his wife's objections, who thought water would be safer) and told me in a rapturous text how much he enjoyed it. I thought, good for him! 

There is a character In one of John Steinbeck's books who advises somebody mourning a lost relationship to go through the motions, to act out being alive, like in a play, because eventually it stops being playacting, and becomes true. Sometimes it takes a long while. Can you see yourself start on this path? Perhaps by identifying a single action that you can commit to every day, however small or symbolic? Water a plant, feed the birds? I am solution-oriented person, and I want so much to help you...

Thank you for your kind words. I know it seems like I'm miserable all the time, but I don't set out to be. If good things were to happen, and sometimes they do, I am ready to receive them. I, alas, have no expectations, and I don't get upset when something happens that disappoints me. There's a show in L.A. that I would have loved to get tickets for, but the ticket costs are outrageous- my brother just isn't willing to shell out that kind of coin anymore, with gas and the drive out there. No biggie. I take what I can get. We have an event we're going to in L.A. next week, so that's something to look forward to. 

I get solace from my morning walk and talk with Annette. I just wish so much that I knew what she's doing in Heaven. I appreciate the help this Forum provides. I think I may have found a weekly grief group with in-person people here in town. Now I need to try to find the courage to go. Maybe after I get the next booster (I always have an excuse!). I know what I'm doing now is not sustainable. I don't expect any kind of relationship ever again, but a local friend who can understand loss would be nice. 

[Gwenivere]

I so wish I could do something that helped but I can’t beyond telling you I care about you.  It breaks my heart you feel so bad.  I don’t care about celebrities. They have more money which is what medical care care has come to.  It can’t buy happiness , but could buy help I and so many others need.  I’m glad you found a local grief group to try.  You might discover a friend.  Dee and I always liked each other a lot, but when we found that common bond it brought us so much closer.  I understand being nervous, especially with a preexisting anxiety condition.  I’m an outgoing person by nature so once I feel comfortable I do fine in groups.  It’s why I play bingo here.  For the company.  Feeling a part of the continuing world.  It’s so easy to withdraw and get lost in the 'crazy' thoughts.  Keeping a balance is the challenge.

[kayc]

Let us know how the grief group goes!  And you're right Gwen, $ isn't everything but lack of it can be very hard.

[nashreed]

Today, I re-read the devastating break-up letter Annette gave me when we first broke up in 1989. I have so few things that she actually wrote, even a scalding missive is comforting- and it is brutal. She never wanted to talk to me again- she said she was going to try and forget me! If I had listened to that letter, I would have missed 30 beautiful (but tough) years. I think about what if I had given up on her then. She said in the letter that "just as you're sure that I'm the one, I'm just as sure I'm not". She was usually right about everything! Even in the letter, she mentioned how she hated that I blamed myself for everything. I don't want her to be upset with me still, even in Heaven. I have to stop blaming myself for everything. 

She mentioned in the letter that she had attempted suicide. I thank God she wasn't successful. I'm glad I persisted and saved her from the thoughts that led to that attempt. I just wish I could have saved her from her health problems. 

[kayc]

16 hours ago, nashreed said:

She mentioned in the letter that she had attempted suicide. I thank God she wasn't successful.

Don't you think you were meant to be?  Also, I'm sure she was just as glad that you guys made it through that time intact and got to spend your life together!

I wish you could have saved her health too, me also with George, alas that's not within our power. 

[nashreed]

If I can be completely honest.... It's one week before the two year anniversary and I don't want to live anymore. I've tried to muddle through, but I just don't have it in me anymore. I have suicidal thoughts constantly. I know the reasons not to (and I don't want you all worrying and giving me links to hotlines- I'm just being real with you few people who read my posts: it's funny, I thought about texting suicide prevention just to have someone to text with, but it would be a stranger who doesn't know me or really care). If Naomi Judd can commit suicide with all her money and a husband and loving family, what's stopping me? I truly feel no one would care. My Mom would just blame herself, but she does that no matter what I do that she doesn't like. My brother would miss having someone to tell his opinions to, but he doesn't care to know who I am. You guys on here are great, but it's not the real world. In the real world, I am very, very isolated and empty inside. Nobody will ever give me the love and support that Annette did ever again, and I (selfishly) can't live without it. 

I hate myself. I hate being a man. Every moderately attractive woman I see (mostly in their 20's) is an object of lust and a reminder of what I don't have. My brain should know that I'm 52, fat and creepy and I have no chance with any woman I see, yet I pine for them. I never used to have "eyes" for anyone when Annette was alive, and I hate this about myself. 

I just don't want you all to be disappointed in me if I do stop posting and disappear. It means I had the courage to do what I desperately want to do. I'm tired and bored of life. You should have the right to say "Ok, I've had a good life, I'm ready to end it". Please know this post is not a plea for help or attention or anything other than writing this out to a few folks who can relate. I really, really appreciate the Forum, and your help with navigating this grief, but I'm tired of it. I just want to be with Annette. 

James

[kayc]

I am so sorry, James.  I've had down times but haven't felt the urge the urge to end it all since the early days after George suddenly died, and I realized it wasn't that I wanted to die so much as I didn't want to go through what I'd go through to live!  I have Kodie to take care of now, he's a huge incentive to keep plugging away.  Life is a struggle, the older I get, yet I look for good moments, good things that happen in my day.  People and circumstances can disappoint or be a letdown, yes, but so can some be good.  My Mother's Day bombed out just as Christmas and Easter did, but I had a good talk with George on the phone (from this group) and it greatly helped.  I feel you may be stuck in a rut.  I wish you could get professional help so you could venture out and around people and feel useful again, hold a job, move out on your own.  You are young yet although you don't see it.  I was your age when George died, still had my life in front of me, now I'm turning 70, alone, on my own, it's getting harder, worst of all is feeling like no one cares.  I live with purpose, that helps, but first it takes discovering what that purpose is; unless we get out of ourselves it can be very hard to go through our days, the more inward they become.  I see Gwen's situation and how she must be feeling, she so much needs her day brightened a bit, it doesn't take much to make a difference to other people's lives, I realize it's harder limited by the internet, but I hope knowing someone out here cares helps a bit.  I didn't realize Naomi commit suicide, I knew she'd died.  That's so sad.

[kayc]

Suicide: Read This First
Thoughts Of Suicide in Grief
Befrienders Worldwide | Emotional support to prevent suicide worldwide

[V. R.]

James, you're only 52,not 102. I'm two years older than you, don't you think I've had those suicidal thoughts too, like so many others in our situation? You have mentioned in other posts that you love listening to music. I was reading about Eric Clapton and how writing the song "Tears in heaven" after his son's tragic death helped him and saved his sanity, his words in an interview: "I unconsciously used music as a healing agent". Reading the lyrics it seems that he has had thoughts of wanting to be with his son, but realises it is wrong to do that because he doesn't 'belong there', he has to 'carry on' with his life and 'be strong'. Don't you think our lost soulmates would cry tears in heaven if they could hear us having these terrible thoughts? We wouldn't want to cause this sadness for them, would we? 

We are all here to listen to you James. I look forward to reading all your posts, even if sometimes I'm feeling too down to reply. 

Enza

[Gwenivere]

What annoys me is how we can’t talk openly about it as it makes others feel the need to talk us out of those very valid feelings.  They don’t like them. I know they care, but they don’t see it would help more to have them validated for what they are.  

I don’t want links, articles, studies and stuff like that. When you want that big an escape, those mean nothing as you aren’t In a ‘rational' state of mind.  It’s just part and emptiness.  
 

My counselor and friend  get it because they’ve been there.   I don’t want advice because I’ know all that.   I don’t want to talk solutions often.  I just want to talk.  And feels it’s OK to talk.  I don’t to people I know could not take it.  I’m tired of hearing it will get better.  I’m in the now.  
 

I don’t even know if this makes sense. I don’t want things hinged to it like someone’s sobriety.  I don’t have my dog to give me purpose.  It’s cold and I need a hand to hold. 

 

[nashreed]

You get it, Gwen. I'm ultimately a chicken, and I probably won't act on these thoughts- but they overwhelm me, and they're.... comforting. I've read where commiting suicide does not mean you can't go to Heaven. That's a relief. I think of people who are in terrible pain, or who have had assisted suicide because of their health being so bad, so hopeless... Surely there's mercy for these poor souls. 

My Mom is in total denial and couldn't even fathom that Naomi Judd would do such a thing. I absolutely cannot talk about what I feel with her, so this Forum is all I have, and there's only a handful of people reading this, but it's enough to be heard and understood. Ultimately people just want to be heard. Annette changed me into someone who has to be open with their feelings and I can't go back to the repressed and cold and bitter person I used to be- the way my family still is. I've changed. They never will, and that conflict is part of why I just want this life to be over. They're all I have, but they drive me bonkers. 

[kayc]

16 hours ago, Gwenivere said:

What annoys me is how we can’t talk openly about it as it makes others feel the need to talk us out of those very valid feelings.

Only because it's such a permanent thing to do and no one can see the future or what it holds, and yes I DO care.  I have had people THANK me later for pointing out things they hadn't considered.  He is still pretty young.  I'm not talking him OUT of FEELING as he does, just acting on it.  And someone on my other group mentioned it to their therapist and got locked up for it!  So not so easy to talk to a professional about feeling suicidal, besides they keep it a part of your permanent medical records!  GOOD to talk about here, a lot safer!  No two situations can compare.  Personally I'm GLAD I didn't act on it when I lost George!  I never would have known Arlie, Miss Mocha, Kitty, Chappy, or my grandkids!  I wouldn't be here for my daughter or even my son, even though I don't think he needs me.  There's other people I've made a difference to in their lives too...I'm not done yet.

I think V. R. pointed out some good things.

16 hours ago, nashreed said:

Ultimately people just want to be heard.

Absolutely!  And that's the one thing I struggle with, no one seems to want to listen/care.  Not minimizing this place but it's kind of sad when you have to go on line to be heard/cared about, BUT!!!  I'm sure glad this place and all of you are here!!!

[kayc]

16 hours ago, nashreed said:

I've read where commiting suicide does not mean you can't go to Heaven.

I don't see for the life of me how committing suicide would but what if I'm wrong?  On that off chance, I think I'll pass...eternity is too big a gamble for me.

Years ago my coworker commit suicide, I'd known him since he was a wee boy in my Sunday School Class, worked for his dad and with their family!  I was close to them all, I saw what they went through, it was hard.  It was right before his sister's wedding.  Had he held on one more day, his psychiatrist was going to switch his meds, maybe that would have helped him.  All I know is he struggled.  None of us judged him, but their (former) church did, said he wouldn't go to heaven.  That infuriated me!  They got professional help, were assured that church was off base, and God doesn't judge people for mental issues they can't help...for whatever reason he didn't feel he could last one more day...that's not something to judge him for!  His dog was next to him when he shot himself, breaks my heart for the dog.  His folks couldn't adopt the dog because his mom was allergic, he had to be rehomed.  This reason alone is enough to keep me trying even though it gets wearisome sometimes.  No one will ever know the effort I put into trying and trying to remain positive when I feel no one ultimately cares and I'm all alone.

16 hours ago, Gwenivere said:

I don’t have my dog to give me purpose.  It’s cold and I need a hand to hold. 

My hope still holds for you to be able to have her back with you.  Oh Gwen...my heart breaks for you, I know it's hard, and I KNOW you need a soft place to land, to be able to talk, and I know you're sick of people's unthinking advice that you've already covered backwards and forwards!  And I hope you'll always be able to do just that here...talk...I'm listening.

[nashreed]

It is sad KayC, You can understand what it's like. Even with your having children and neighbors and acquaintances, no one cares to listen to you, get to know what you're feeling- what you're really going through. Someone to take the time to be there. Everyone is just self centered and selfish these days. I stopped pursuing a friendship with the one school friend I have in town that was even willing to get together with me for a pizza. He has his happy life and wife and child and he doesn't want to hear my tales of woe. It's a bummer and blemish on their good life. He hasn't contacted me for months- I'm sure he doesn't miss me or care at all. He has a full life- I have no place. Everyone my age has a family or pack by now, unless they're homeless- of which there are plenty of here. Even my family- two deeply unhappy people don't want to hear about my problems. Why would they want to be brought even further down? 

Just being in this world the way it is now is too sad and depressing. No one has consideration for anyone. The playground in my mobile home park was somewhere me and Annette could go to talk and lay on the grass. It used to have a swing set and benches....now it's full of trash and dirty. I've seen homeless people camped in back there and they've had to block a lot off- no swings or benches anymore. The park we used to have fun in, rolling down the grassy hills, is now a homeless drug meeting place. There's just nothing good in my future. It's all gone. 

 

[Gwenivere]

6 hours ago, kayc said:

someone on my other group mentioned it to their therapist and got locked up for it!  So not so easy to talk to a professional about feeling suicidal, besides they keep it a part of your permanent medical records! 

I can talk about this without fear.  Even if they did report it, all one has to do is say they changed their minds and you cannot be locked up.  As for my permanent record, I don’t care.  If you can’t talk to a professional, it’s useless.  One of mine was himself.  That created a common bridge.  I’m careful who I tell because of making them uncomfortable.  It’s easier to have them think I’m just sad, more than usual.  

 

6 hours ago, kayc said:

No two situations can compare. 

Absolutely.  That is why I find safe places and in them can feel validated.  Yes, some things I would have missed out on.  But not grieving something I never knew.  The irony is it has reached this point now to factor them in. Makes it more painful.  

[kayc]

James, I feel everything you wrote, I hear you, I get it, I understand, completely!  Gwen, I hear you too!  That's what I love about this place, regardless of neighbors/friends/lack of the above, we have this place to come to and oh how I appreciate it!  It's like sacred ground to me!

I guess I just have to appreciate what I had.  I see my son, so busy with his family/life...it's scary how reminiscent it is of mine...only I never had connection with his dad (my long term marriage), not sure if he does with his wife but man he's sure trying his best!  Yeah, I did too.  I was lucky to get George and our close connection, even if only for a time, it was more precious to me than gold.  Now I'm old, alone, don't have anything to look forward to that I can count on, so I stay in this moment and enjoy what there is for right now...I fear the day what health/ability I do have will be gone, where will I be?  Will I be stuck in a room in the city with no one close to me, unable to have a dog or eat the way I want to?  Unable to enjoy the peacefulness of nature, unable to drive?  IDK, I try not to go there...what will be will be and all of my fear or worry won't change the outcome, so I stay  in today.  It's enough to handle.  Life is getting harder, that's for sure, the older we get.  The 40s and 50s were good compared to now, enjoy the possibilities while you may.

Gwen, I continue to hope/pray for you and for some semblance of good to come into your life.  You have a friend in Dee, that is one positive, a real one.  My last in-person friend was Virgie, she moved to TX seven years ago...no one has taken her place.  I'm alone.  I appreciate talking to George but don't want to wear out my welcome, he was forbearant enough with our long phone call on Mother's Day!

[nashreed]

On 5/10/2022 at 10:46 AM, V. R. said:

James, you're only 52,not 102. I'm two years older than you, don't you think I've had those suicidal thoughts too, like so many others in our situation? You have mentioned in other posts that you love listening to music. I was reading about Eric Clapton and how writing the song "Tears in heaven" after his son's tragic death helped him and saved his sanity, his words in an interview: "I unconsciously used music as a healing agent". Reading the lyrics it seems that he has had thoughts of wanting to be with his son, but realises it is wrong to do that because he doesn't 'belong there', he has to 'carry on' with his life and 'be strong'. Don't you think our lost soulmates would cry tears in heaven if they could hear us having these terrible thoughts? We wouldn't want to cause this sadness for them, would we? 

We are all here to listen to you James. I look forward to reading all your posts, even if sometimes I'm feeling too down to reply. 

Enza

Enza,

Thinking a lot about your post. I don't want to let Annette down- I truly don't. I talk to her every morning, but it's the same repetitive drivel about how miserable I am. I wish I had good things to relay. I wish I knew what she would expect me to be doing. She didn't want me to work. She was heartbroken that she couldn't work and I had to step in. She wants me to be happy, but I'm sure she realizes that finding anyone even remotely close to what I had with her is almost impossible. So I'm here with this life I hate, in this place I hate. When I was growing up, the family mobile home was great, and the neighbors were nice- mostly older folks. I used to deliver Avon for my Mom! Now it's just rude, inconsiderate people with their loud kids, loud music and loud dogs. It's seriously like living in a kennel. Annette always laughed at me for my nostalgia for this town. She knew what a craphole it's become, but I was in denial. A nice place to visit but it sucks to live here. 

Music certainly is the only thing that has kept me going. I shouldn't spend money on it, but it's the only thing I have to look forward to. I always have headphones on, listening to Spotify, training to block out the world. There's so many love songs though. I like to listen to as much variety as possible, and I don't want to always listen to weird, Frank Zappa type stuff all the time. 

I just feel lost and my sad little life is unfulfilling, but at the same time the routine I have is necessary and keeps me sane. I hate any interruption of it. It's a frustrating conundrum. 

[kayc]

I'm sorry, James.  I wish you lived here in the country where it is peaceful.  Of course you have to put up with skunks under the storage room and racoons making their abode in your attic!   And then there's the shoveling snow and picking up branches.  (My HDL is excellent!) But I would not trade it for all of the noise/crime/traffic of the city!  And I never have to lock my door.  I've left my keys in my pickup for ten years but so far no takers! 

[nashreed]

Thanks Kay. Of course, I'd be the one to disturb the quiet. If I had the money to live out in the country, with sparse neighbors, I would get me a $50,000 stereo and let 'er rip. That would be the dream. It's really, really depressing living in a town that's so run down and full of homeless people and drug addicts. What happened to my childhood town? 

This two year anniversary is so hard. No one to help me through it like last year. It doesn't get any easier or better. Life isn't worth living without love. Thank you all for at least listening. It's like sending out an SOS on a telegraph, or a message in a bottle. I just am crying out to be heard. 

[V. R.]

James, I'm sorry that the place where you lived and loved has changed so much in a negative way.  Unfortunately that's quite common nowadays in this degrading society of ours, it's never the other way round. Like Kay, I live in the country, came to live here soon after we married, our children have grown up here, although all their friends live in town (20 minute drive). I would never go back to living in town in an apartment, stuck inside all the time,although I was born and grew up in London (my parents emigrated there in the 60s like so many other Europeans) , one of the most chaotic cities in the world.Have never had regrets leaving, I left a full time office job to move to Italy. Everyone thought I was crazy. 

Today I spent all day stocking up three tons of firewood with my son. It's true what they say, strenuous work is a healing agent, especially if it's outdoors in country surroundings, helps you release all that pain you have stored inside you, It's a bit like a pressure cooker - if you block the valve and the vapour can't get out, the pressure cooker could explode,or a car exhaust pipe - same effect. Mind you it's onlya temporary relief and I was still thinking of my husband, I do it 24hrs a day. I kept stopping, staring into space shaking my head and asking my husband why he wasn't here to join us, we used to do this job together, how is it possible that he just doesn't exist anymore? 

James, I think however you spend money for music, it's money well-spent.  if I didn't have my piano, I don't know what I would do, this is my 2nd healing agent, helps me get through the day, looking up songs on Spotify and playing them and singing along. 

My 3rd healing agent is having my friends here in this great group.

[nashreed]

Oh Enza, I know what it's like to just not believe that my spouse is not on this planet, on this plane of existence. I still have thoughts that I left Annette in Tulsa- that I abandoned her. I know in my heart that she's in Heaven, but I am so frustrated that I'm probably so spiritually dense that if she is trying to contact me, I wouldn't get the messages. I desperately am trying to stay connected to her, but it's harder every day. I am fighting the loss of my life with her still- I'm so mad that I was robbed of our little life. Life without her smile, her sweet naivety, is so depressing. All I can do to get by is distract, distract, distract.