A friends senseless words

[R.Everit55]

I had lunch with an old friend from work.  A man who I have respected for years.  He asked how I was doing and I thought I could be honesty.  Apparently that was a hurtful mistake.  I told him the last couple days I've been struggling to be positive or even smile.  He asked why.  I said because I'm aching terribly for Mary.  He said you just need to move on and get through it.  I admit I took it to heart.  Thought maybe he is right.  I'm still questioning my grief now.  Maybe I do need to move on and get over it.  But how?  If someone who has lost their soulmate best friend love of their life could tell me how.  Now that would be a miracle because in my heart I know it's not possible to get over it.  My head is playing tricks on me.  I am better off staying home.  People are clueless.  .  I came home and snuggled with my Gracie girl.  In tears.  She was looking at Grampy like she knew what my tears were for.  Bless her heart.  Maybe she senses.  

[enna]

Oh, Butch. Unfortunately, we know people just do not understand. I am so glad you are able to snuggle with Gracie. I think she does sense your sadness.  

[kayc]

Butch, it was good for you to get out with a friend...unfortunately it was someone who doesn't know what it's like.  Even other people who have lost their spouse may not get it because their relationship wasn't the same as ours was, so their loss is not the same.  And factoring in personality differences, we all handle grief different.  Incidentally, Marty just posted a link to an article that explains some of those differences:
http://www.griefhealingblog.com/2013/10/how-we-mourn-understanding-our.html

Next time someone tells you that you need to move on, I hope you'll tell them if only that were possible, but this grief is lifelong and it's something we adjust to rather than get over.

I'm glad you have your little Gracie.  

[R.Everit55]

I should have known better than to expect understanding from someone who knows no such loss.  I have a woman friend of both myself and was Marys friend as well who lost her husband.  I may try to get back in touch with her.  She's an amazing person full of understanding.  

 

[CharKath]

Hi Butch, sorry your old friend ruined your day. I've been down that road several times with my friends. I've never said anything to them when they say bad things like that, but I've often thought being punched might of been less painful. I had quit talking about Charley because of such things. Now that I've found all of you here on this site, I'll talk about Charley here and won't have to worry about such remarks from everyone else. I guess unless your really sure who your talking to, mum's the word. Hold and love your little girl, she'll never let you down.

CharKath

[rdownes]

I am sorry for your friends response I know it is hard when people don't understand I know me personally I will never get over and move on I love my Kevin to much

[Cookie]

On June 17, 2016 at 7:50 PM, R.Everit55 said:

I had lunch with an old friend from work.  A man who I have respected for years.  He asked how I was doing and I thought I could be honesty.  Apparently that was a hurtful mistake.  I told him the last couple days I've been struggling to be positive or even smile.  He asked why.  I said because I'm aching terribly for Mary.  He said you just need to move on and get through it.  I admit I took it to heart.  Thought maybe he is right.  I'm still questioning my grief now.  Maybe I do need to move on and get over it.  But how?  If someone who has lost their soulmate best friend love of their life could tell me how.  Now that would be a miracle because in my heart I know it's not possible to get over it.  My head is playing tricks on me.  I am better off staying home.  People are clueless.  .  I came home and snuggled with my Gracie girl.  In tears.  She was looking at Grampy like she knew what my tears were for.  Bless her heart.  Maybe she senses.  

You are not alone.  I have also struggled with the same thing.  I have been told I need to be positive, move on, not dwell on what I can't change, etc., etc.  Yes, it hurts because what these people don't get is that you more than anyone want out of this pain somehow.  Adding isolation to the painful feelings is not helpful.  I have really drawn back many times just because of what you experienced.  I am grateful for this place to be able to talk honestly.  I want to believe there will be a softening of this pain and will be hopeful for that, but in the meantime, support is so necessary to help get through.  Hugs to you, Cookie

[Margm]

I occasionally get "barbs" of some sort but they are usually from relatives.  When I do, they do without my company and I guarantee you, that is punishment enough.  I do not have time to waste it on people that are not of like minds with me.  I can remember being young and afraid I would hurt someone's feelings with something I might say.  I can remember saying things I should not say.  But, that is the key, I did know what I did was wrong.  If the insensitive dolts that come around you offer anything but love and sympathy, turn your back on them and walk away.  You certainly do not need them in your life, do you?  If they ask you a senseless question, look them in the eye and say "why do you want to know?"  Either that or use that new thing I have learned, tell them "you take a lot of Tylenol, don't you?"  Then laugh and turn your back on them.  I like that poem about when I get old I will wear purple.  Purple has always been my favorite color and having friends is something that I do take for granted.  And, one thing I like about age, some people need me more than I need them.  Put value on yourself, not these people.

Yesterday because of the turmoil of the day I asked for prayers on public media, the one I share with my friends.  This is one of the many quotes I received: "There are a lot of us in the same club!! We learn to rely on each other for support and understanding!! love you!!" and this came from a cousin.  But, back in the land I am going home to, everyone is my cousin somewhere down the line.  People years ago didn't have any big cities to go to and the bayous and river bottom land provided sustenance to live on.  Maybe that is why I have so many loose screws.

And, I can be bold today, but tomorrow I might be a heap of liquefied humanity.    

[seachelle]

It's a sad reality that people often don't know how to react when death occurs in the life of someone they know.  I feel like we are so removed from death that it often comes as a shock, and the people we need to support us are as scared as we are because on some level they must know that this grief awaits them in their future.  Maybe they like to imagine that when it happens to them they will, "be strong", "move on" etc.  We know it's just not that easily.  Luckily when it is their turn, they will have us to talk to if they are so lucky.

[Clematis]

I think you are right-people really don't know what to say and so they come up with annoying cliches, that are really insensitive if you think about it. I don't know how many people said to me after my dad died, "well it was his time", "he's in a better place now", "he's out of pain now". These were mostly from people who really didn't know him or whether he was in pain or in a bad place, or anything else. The latest one is "I'm sorry for your loss"; I have seen teenagers whip that one out. When my dad died I was a little concerned that I might lose control and slap someone who said "I'm sorry for your loss". But I didn't slap anybody. Every time I heard this I would say, "Yeah, me too!" and then just start talking about how hard it had been. I found that even though people didn't know how to start, they were willing to listen. I also found out that when I shared my experience with them, people frequently shared some loss of theirs with me, and I felt some comradery and less isolated. 

[KATPILOT]

I remember watching this movie early when devastation was new called "Unstoppable". In the movie Denzel Washington mentioned that his wife had died of cancer five years earlier and Chris Pine said "I'm sorry". He replied "Me too".  I was hearing people tell me that so many times that I adopted it as my come back if just to have a come back at all.  But "I'm sorry for your loss" ? That just never upset me. I knew they were genuinely sad for me and somehow I found comfort in that.  What always got me upset was "she's in a better place now". We thought we were in heaven when she died.

4 hours ago, Clematis said:

 I also found out that when I shared my experience with them, people frequently shared some loss of theirs with me, and I felt some comradery and less isolated. 

So true for me too Laura.

[kevin]

Until you experience a loss of a loved one you will never know the feeling....This" getting over it" is the most insensitive statement I've been subjected in over the last 11 months.  I have become very abrupt with people who make these offerings. I have accepted that life can co-exist with Grief, sometimes in conflict, but co-exist nontheless....prayers to the families inTurkey 

[kayc]

I'm with you, Steve, it never bothered me someone saying "I'm sorry for your loss".  What I DIDN'T need was their ignorant assessment "He's in a better place" (better than with me?).  "His time was up"  (not with me it wasn't!).  "He wouldn't have liked being disabled (how do they know, maybe he would have valued what life was left and found enjoyable things he could do!).  Sometimes they're just better off saying they're sorry and leave it at that.

[Clematis]

I think the worst came from someone very near and dear to me, who works in mental health and should know better. She said to me, " Well, it's not like you lost your child or your spouse or something." No, I didn't lose my child or my spouse. I lost the guy who told me as a youth, "no one will ever love you more than your parents do" and was right-at least about himself. No one even has or will love me as much as he did. I also lost the guy who taught me how to catch a frog, paddle a canoe, tune and play the ukulele, fix a flat tire on my bike, tie my shoes, write a paragraph and an essay, take care of and appreciate good tools, and ultimately how to be successful in life. He taught me how to catch a fish and that no one else really wanted to clean fish you caught soI'd better either learn to clean them myself or prepare to pay someone else to do it. (I decided to paddle my sister around while she fished-and she could clean her own fish. But I'd get the boat right where she wanted and keep it there very quietly, which is not easy in an aluminum canoe on a rocky river.) I lost the guy who in his last years was my best friend and constant companion. People in town say they hardly ever saw one of us without the other. Of course we each did things independently, but we were seen as a unit and a duo. We were...

I lost the guy who was interested in everything I had to say or paint or write. I lost the guy who would rescue me when I got into trouble, financial or otherwise. In the middle of his last summer, I ran out of gas in town, with the cat in the car and it was 100 degrees. He could barely walk, but he got in his car and rescued me. During his last winter, I got locked out of my back door when the security bar slid down in it's slot so the slider wouldn't open. It was dark and cold and I was outside with socks but no shoes and no coat. My back yard/patio is down in a pit. Even if I had been able to climb the rock wall through the rose bushes and stumble through a rocky ditch, through the rocks and cactus behind the house and back down a rocky slope without falling repeatedly, I wouldn't have been able to get in the front door. I did have my phone in my pocket and called him. He was asleep, but got up out of bed and drove over to my house to save me. He fixed things for me, he built things for me, and he taught me how to fix and build things. He taught me how to do so many things, and in was always there for me. Even in the years when I was giving him hell for some of his misdeeds to me when I was young (and he deserved it-he wasn't a saint), when I ended up in San Diego with a friend who turned to be a crazed bipolar off her meds manic (I thought she was going to kill me), I called him collect on his vacation on the Maryland shore and he helped me figure out how to get a flight back home by finding a travel agent. He probably paid for it as well-I don't remember. That was before cell phones and the internet. He taught me how to identify and deal with black widow spiders when I was a child. I repaid him by hunting down and dealing with the black widow spiders around his house and mine (where he visited) when he was a fragile old man. He loved me unconditionally, and it was mutual.

I couldn't have lost more if I had lost a spouse. It is a devastating loss, and comparing it to other losses is insensitive and rather stupid, because you just can't do it. My sisters lost the same man, but they did not lose a relationship like I did. We all lost my mother, but it was not the same...there won't ever be anyone else for me like him, and that's just how it is...

[MartyT]

Well said, Laura, and I hope it felt good for you to say it! (You might appreciate this article: When Grief Seems Insignificant by Comparison.)  ♥

[R.Everit55]

Hugs to everyone.  Why people say senseless words to us is hurtful.  But that's why we all have each other.  Because we understand.  I just lost my mom.  I haven't encountered senseless words as of yet.  But I have regarding my Mary.  

[kayc]

I lost the person that loved me more than anyone ever could when I lost George.  I understand for you, Laura, that person was your dad...in my case, it was not.

NO ONE should tell someone "At least you didn't......"  because whatever they are about to utter in their ignorant little minds is going to discount your loss, which is wrong!

We should never discount someone else's experience!  We should let them know we heard them.  We should validate their experience!  We should care!  But NEVER discount their experience!

[KarenK]

Laura,

Your words brought both tears and a smile to my heart. Your dad sounds like a fine man and a pillar of strength, a lot like mine except for the fishing. My dad was not an outdoorsman, but I did learn all the outdoor stuff from Ron years later. It sounds silly, but when I was in labor with my daughter at age 17, it was my dad's hand I wanted to squeeze, not my ex-husband's. He is a very nice fellow, but never my "rock" as my dad had been. Ron took over that place when my dad died in '77.

In my long life I have lost my husband, my daughter, both parents, all my aunts and uncles, and both in-laws. Each of those losses were hard. Each of them were different and evoked different types of grief. No one has the right to define YOUR grief. It is yours alone.

The only hurtful thing said to me came from my BIL that I don't care for anyway. It cut me to the core when he stated that he never liked Ron. I take into account that he is mentally ill, but I also know that he is "dumb like a fox" and is a huge user of others. Ron spent years taking care of his needs and providing love and support for his brother. Thank heavens he will never know his brother's true feelings.

[Margm]

Well Karen, I think the worse that was said to me came from relatives.  My sister tries to use psychology on me, tries to make meaning of quotes and then my daughter got in one of her manic anger moods; right after Billy died she said she wished it had been me.  In her epic midnight to morning messages to me, she told me that again.  All I could tell her was that made two of us.   And it does.

Nothing  has changed.  The house is probably still going to sell, but I think this is the lowest I have felt since Billy left.  I just cannot get up any energy to finish it up.  I have to.

[kayc]

People can be thoughtless and cruel.  Too bad we can't wipe such people from our memories.

[Clematis]

1 hour ago, KarenK said:

Laura,

Your words brought both tears and a smile to my heart. Your dad sounds like a fine man and a pillar of strength, a lot like mine except for the fishing...

Thanks, Karen! My dad was great-not perfect, but considering the twisted background he came from and what he went through, he came out more than ok. When he came out to AZ, everyone said to me the same thing, "Oh, I just love your dad-he is the sweetest man!" It took me aback in the beginning because I had never heard anyone say he was sweet. But he loved me-that was for sure. He got to know me quite well in the end, and thought I was terrific-quite the compliment. I remember once having a conversation with him about my sisters and asking him something about why they might have done something. He said, "I really have no idea-I don't really know either of them very well". It seemed to odd, but I realized it was true. We all lived with him when we were growing up, of course, but they lived within an hour of him their entire adult lives until he was 78 and moved out west. They didn't really know him and he really didn't know them. No one bothered to take the trouble to work on it. I invested in getting to know him and what I gained was incredible.

I'm glad you had a dad who was a rock!

 

 

[Clematis]

1 hour ago, Marg M said:

Nothing  has changed.  The house is probably still going to sell, but I think this is the lowest I have felt since Billy left.  I just cannot get up any energy to finish it up.  I have to.

Marg, you are probably exhausted...how could you not be? Try and remember that the more tired you are the worse everything seems, ok? - Laura

[Cookie]

On June 29, 2016 at 0:36 AM, seachelle said:

It's a sad reality that people often don't know how to react when death occurs in the life of someone they know.  I feel like we are so removed from death that it often comes as a shock, and the people we need to support us are as scared as we are because on some level they must know that this grief awaits them in their future.  Maybe they like to imagine that when it happens to them they will, "be strong", "move on" etc.  We know it's just not that easily.  Luckily when it is their turn, they will have us to talk to if they are so lucky.

No one could have said it better....

[Cookie]

On June 29, 2016 at 8:11 PM, Marg M said:

Well Karen, I think the worse that was said to me came from relatives.  My sister tries to use psychology on me, tries to make meaning of quotes and then my daughter got in one of her manic anger moods; right after Billy died she said she wished it had been me.  In her epic midnight to morning messages to me, she told me that again.  All I could tell her was that made two of us.   And it does.

Nothing  has changed.  The house is probably still going to sell, but I think this is the lowest I have felt since Billy left.  I just cannot get up any energy to finish it up.  I have to.

I feel for you Marg.  Right after my husband died, about a month, my daughter told me she needed boundaries when I started to cry in front of her.  Felt like I was slapped.  I realize that she couldn't see my pain because she had so much, but nonetheless, it was hurtful.  Kids are a blessing and sometimes you wonder.  I can also relate to the inertia you are talking about.  I need to change my house and can't seem to get mobilized.  It's been a year and I'm still stuck in mud.  Love to you....Cookie

[Margm]

Her manic anger has subsided now and all is nice and peaceful and she is so sorry.  This is something she cannot seem to help..  My mom was the same way, except she never was sorry for anything she said.  

We are gonna make it, all of us.  I got my Ensure again, had been out of it for a few days and I depend on it first thing in the morning.  Think my system just got out of whack.  Lost a classmate, one lost his wife.  My neighbor told me this morning, and she was not being mean, but it was the truth.  She is three years older than me and she said that wee should  expect this to happen at our age.  I know that.  This friend fell and hit his head and lingered for awhile, knowing no one, tearing his family up and no one could do anything.  Finally, he gave up.  Our wedding anniversary is tomorrow, so I guess it is only  natural that I am down more than usual.  Gotta travel in a few minutes.  Should have been gone yesterday.