If You're Going Through Hell

[KATPILOT]

Just a point.  My dad loved my mom dearly and was married to her for thirty eight years until she died of cancer. My dad could not live alone and married my step mom three years later. They were married for twenty six years until he died. They were close and indeed loved each other but there was a noticeable difference. They were simply just never that close in comparison.  I was of course divorced after twenty year to my high school sweetheart and I thought we were in love only to find in the end, she was not. Okay so I was devastated, it took me a long time to get over that but after the smoke had cleared, I knew had she died and I then found Kathy, I would be looking for her, not my ex. You just know what true love is. You just know a soul mate which I never had till I met her. It's quite impossible to know how it's going to be when we die but my monies on you Gin. I think Al found the person if only because he was more understanding of life and love by the time you met. That is just one factor. The other is your love for him. If you want him, go get him. I just cannot believe that unrequited love exists on the other side. That makes no sense to me at all.

Now my stepmom had a religious faith that gave her the desire to be with God when she left this earth. That was her expectation. That was her hope. We discussed this often after my dad had passed. She never seemed to grieve but focused on her expectation for the after life. That silly lady worried she was not good enough to get there. How dear is that?

So when we think of what is waiting for us consider this. We were born with free will. I can't imagine that being taken away just because we died. And the best thing to remember is that true love trumps everything. So Gin I wouldn't worry. Think about how Al felt about you and how he still does. Perhaps this is the defining moment of faith.

[kayc]

Gin,

Please don't worry so about being with Al again, you will be.  You both want that.  And in my faith, we've been taught that things will be different, but the love and memories continue, just not the negative things like pain or jealousy.  It's hard for me to imagine as this life is all I've ever known, but I take it on faith, which is believing in something yet unseen.  We all have some measure of faith, whether religious or not, I believe this election will come and go and whoever is elected the U.S. will survive.   Okay, maybe not a good example, maybe that's more of a hope than a faith!

[Clematis]

19 hours ago, Gin said:

Another issue I have is more bizarre. Al was a widower when I met him.  He always said how much better our love was than anything he had before.  What if his late wife wants him as much as I do?  How will that work?  I told you it was weird.

My mother died 11 years before my dad. After about a year he came out to AZ to be with me and we had ten great years being friends and family to each other. I know that he missed my mother terribly and there were many times that he wished he could just join her but always concluded that I need him as much as he needed me and that he should stay here - alive - as long as he was meant to be here. 

I have wondered a lot about where he is and what he's doing now, and I have no clues. When he talks to me it's always something supportive of me and never about what he is doing. I have wondered if at some point I would stop hearing from him because he was with my mother and had no more time for me, but that doesn't seem to be the case. I have the feeling that he is spending time with my mother. I also have the feeling that my mother is spending time with her father and paternal grandmother, who have both been gone for many years - as well as her sister, who recently died. My mother adored her grandmother, and they were both artists. She also idolized her father and they were very close. They were very much alike and I don't think my mother ever stopped missing her dad.

I guess we can't really know what happens after we pass, but I do think that the same dimensions that bind us are not applicable to people who are "on the other side of the veil". People say that time is not the same for them as it is for us and I think that's true. I think the 11 years my parents were separated by death was a lot more difficult for him than for her. I truly believe that she was watching over him even though she was reconnecting with her father and grandmother and beloved dog Beaux from her childhood. Somehow it seems that none of that conflicts for them. I have often heard people say that once people are in a spiritual form they are freed from the neurotic things that made things difficult for them and people close to them when they were alive. I don't have the sense that they are angry and spiteful and envious, or any of the things that may have made it hard for us when they were alive - like my mother.

I hear people talk a lot about the veil that separates us from those who have gone, and that while it seems very far from us and we can't see them, that they can see us clearly and feel close by. I feel like my dad responds to me when I am very distressed, when I talk to him out loud, and when there is something in my immediate environment that would get his attention - like imminent danger. For some reason I am sensitive to that kind of thing. My dad was not and never got any messages from my mother. What I got my mother was rather indirect, but it's hard to say whether she communicated with me through rabbits because that's all I was ready to hear from her or because that's all she could do. One way or another, I eventually got the message from her that she really did love me, which I never got when she was alive. But that seems to have been important to her to communicate.

I don't have the sense that people who have passed have to choose between one person and another. I believe that my parents are together and my mother also is with her father, sister, grandfather and the others as much as they want to be, but that doesn't seem to keep him from being available to me when I especially need him. Anyway, those are just my thoughts... 

[TerriL]

I'm beginning to wonder if I may be the one who died and I'm living in Hell right now. In the past week, I have been waiting for help that still has not come with no phone call to explain either, I've texted several people and not one has answered me back. I'm thinking maybe they can't hear or see me. Maybe it's like the Sixth Sense movie and I only think I'm still here. Maybe this house is Hell and being without Paul is the sentence I'm serving. Maybe my brother in law is actually Satan. (That would at least explain a lot.) Am I really writing this? Can any of you see this? I may sound nuts, but maybe that's just the point I'm getting to. But, the way I'm being treated by the people who supposedly LOVE me? It might not be all that far-fetched a theory after all. 

[KATPILOT]

We may not know what goes on in the afterlife Laura but we can have a pretty good idea that human restrictions just don't apply and time has no meaning.

For what it's worth, the medium I have seen has told me that Kathy was with her mom and them her dad as well after they crossed over. I kind of felt it made a lot of sense since there was a flurry of electrical activity around the house just before her mom and then her dad died. After they were gone, Kathy disappeared for months. It stopped suddenly and completely.  I believe they were united for a while and over again at times. I can't know of course but it's all part of my faith. I guess enough has happened over the years to make me raise more than an eyebrow.

9 minutes ago, TerriL said:

I'm beginning to wonder if I may be the one who died and I'm living in Hell right now. In the past week, I have been waiting for help that still has not come with no phone call to explain either, I've texted several people and not one has answered me back. I'm thinking maybe they can't hear or see me. Maybe it's like the Sixth Sense movie and I only think I'm still here. Maybe this house is Hell and being without Paul is the sentence I'm serving. Maybe my brother in law is actually Satan. (That would at least explain a lot.) Am I really writing this? Can any of you see this? I may sound nuts, but maybe that's just the point I'm getting to. But, the way I'm being treated by the people who supposedly LOVE me? It might not be all that far-fetched a theory after all. 

Yes I can see you Terri. I am laughing because I was thinking similar thoughts when I first lost Kathy. I thought heaven and hell must be reversed. I was a jerk most of my life and she was an angel. So she must have stayed in heaven where I thought we both lived...........................And I went straight to hell.  I went to sleep at 11:30 lying next to her in the hospice home to be awakened an hour later, the nurse telling me she was gone. No, I was the one who crossed over. Leaving her behind and facing my eternal destiny. Of course I have overcome that belief.

[TerriL]

Clematis, in the Wiccan religion, Halloween (actually Samhain or All Hallow's Eve), is the night when the veil between the living and dead is at its thinnest, allowing the souls to cross over to visit with loved ones. It's actually a very reverent evening, where people light candles to honor and guide their loved ones and place food and drink out to nourish them on their journey. Obviously, the food and drink are symbolic, much like leaving milk and cookies out for Santa. If the living souls don't eat it, it's going to sit there.  Jack O'Lanterns, which originated in Ireland, came about as a way to scare off the "bad" spirits who might try to cross over with the good ones. I used to love sitting out on the front patio with Paul, handing out candy to the young children all dressed up and so proud of their costumes. I miss that. Last Halloween was my first without Paul in 34 years and I shut all the lights out early and didn't even venture outside. We had started October out by putting all the decorations up together as usual and the month ended with me having to take them all down alone. I'm not putting any decorations up this year nor am I handing out candy. I will light candles for my Nana, my parents and Paul. Maybe I'll crack open one of the Coors Lights he still has in the patio fridge and leave it out for him. I know he'd appreciate it. 

[TerriL]

5 minutes ago, KATPILOT said:

Of course I have overcome that belief.

I'm waiting to do that, but it sure has not been easy lately. Of course, if you thought you were also in Hell, that would explain why YOU can see me! lol My mom passed away at home under hospice care. I was sleeping at home (Paul was at the fire station) and I suddenly jolted awake. I looked at the clock and it was 4:00am and I had the instant thought "My mom just passed away." It was almost as if I felt her presence. I shook it off and told myself I was being dramatic, that I must have just had a bad dream and I should go back to sleep. About fifteen minutes later, the phone was ringing and that's when I knew. It was my sister, telling me that our mom had passed at 4:00am. Now I know with certainty that my mom WAS in the room with me, telling me she was leaving and that she loved me. I also had experiences after my Nana had passed away, but it was via the telephone. My Nana and I had actually made a pact at one point. We promised each other that whoever went first would communicate with the other to let them know there is something beyond this life. We never told anyone else about it. I won't go into details because it would take too long, but I know that I received messages from my grandmother because the events that occurred were far too specific in nature to be mere coincidence. The odds of what happened being simply an "accident" would be astronomical. 

Maybe the times when Paul has been quiet were him being with his parents and middle brother again. Maybe even with my parents and grandmother. But, I know Paul. He'll get to the point where he will tell them he has to break away to check on me because he knows how much I'm missing him and still need him. He always worried about me. 

[Margm]

My son thinks I am psychic.  I know I am just psycho..  

[TerriL]

34 minutes ago, Marg M said:

My son thinks I am psychic.  I know I am just psycho..  

Well, you DO have x-ray vision, too, and can leap tall buildings in a single bound, right?

[Margm]

[Gwenivere]

I had a dream last night that Steve had died.  In the dream he wasn't dead so I was shaken and told him about it.  He said he wasn't going anywhere, held me and said go back to sleep.  Then I woke up to it being true.  The brain can be very cruel.

[brat#2]

Oh Gwen, you are right the brain can be very cruel.  So sorry it was just a dream.  Sending you hugs

Joyce

 

[TerriL]

Gwen, I've had dreams like that, too. There is the possibility though that the dream could have been a visitation by Steve. Maybe he was letting you know that he is still there with you and was holding you as you slept. It's little comfort when we wake up to cold reality, of course. We're so happy and hopeful while we're asleep having the dream---it's so wonderful to see them and talk with them---and then your eyes open to the loneliness. Those are the dreams I wish could come true for all of us. 

[Widowedbysuicide]

I just wanted to say I've been reading and learning from you all.  So sorry we have all this pain and confusion.

[Gin]

Marita,

hope you are doing OK.  Keep reading and posting.

Gin

[Patty65]

5 hours ago, Gwenivere said:

The brain can be very cruel.

So, so cruel, Gwen  

Patty

[Margm]

Marita, just keep on keeping on.  That is all any of us can do.  Some times I get on a writing kick and cannot shutup.  Sometimes I go back and delete it.  Most times I just have run on fingers about nothing.  Jump in anytime.  

[Patty65]

From my journal last week...

 I felt the need to sleep on his side of the bed.  Without thinking, I said to him - "you MUST be here, I NEED you here."  I heard in my head, so clearly, "I am here."

"What is it like??" I said in my head, reaching to turn off the light and hoping I could find a vision of him.  I felt him though.

"I can't wait for you to see" he said.  The way I felt him around me enveloping me gave me a flash of the Knowing moment -- the moment we first met in person, after a 3 month phone romance -- the moment I knew he was my soulmate.

I said, "Show me!"  He said, "Watch Avatar - the trees..."

I had wanted to watch that movie again, but the love story, the memories of watching it with him... I had taped it but decided I couldn't handle it.

But I watched it. And cried.  And I saw the trees -- the trees whose roots are all connected on the whole planet, all connected to the Tree of Souls.  Yet even connected to the Tree of Souls, Sigourney Weaver's character could not be saved.  She was not strong enough.  Her injuries too severe.

I've been trying to hard to connect with him -- I just don't know what is wishful thinking, what may be his messages to me, or if it even matters which it is.  I've been doing an 8 hour sleep meditation audio book that in the middle of the night when you are sleeping, it brings you to a place of connection.  But instead of feeling better, and more rested, I just feel more and more depressed.  I'm trying not to give up on it, but I just don't know if I am treading water in the middle of the ocean thinking that rescue is on the way, when it is not.

Such a hard road. Grasping to hold on and keep going.

But today, on the way to work, I was listening to NPR and the CEO of Canter Fitzgerald, who lost his whole company to 9/11 including his brother.  He was trying to convince his sister to go talk to the other families, but he said she was curled up in a ball her heart completely shattered, and she kept saying NO she could not.  He said to her that -- in order to talk to those grieving shattered hearts of the families, it should come from someone who has had their heart shattered broken too, otherwise, that person's voice would just sound  like tin.

And I thought of everyone here as I cried down the highway. So much of the voices around me sound like tin.  But not here, not anyone here. There is such a deep resonance to every word.

((((hugs))))

Patty

[Clematis]

8 minutes ago, Patty65 said:

I felt the need to sleep on his side of the bed.  Without thinking, I said to him - "you MUST be here, I NEED you here."  I heard in my head, so clearly, "I am here."

"What is it like??" I said in my head, reaching to turn off the light and hoping I could find a vision of him.  I felt him though.

"I can't wait for you to see" he said.  The way I felt him around me enveloping me gave me a flash of the Knowing moment -- the moment we first met in person, after a 3 month phone romance -- the moment I knew he was my soulmate.

I said, "Show me!"  He said, "Watch Avatar - the trees..."

That's really cool, Patty, that you're connecting with him.

This is the way it seems to me. Remember how it used to be before cell phones and pagers and all that? You'd call somebody and sometimes you'd get lucky and they'd pick up the phone and you had the immediate gratification. But sometimes you'd have to leave a message and you would probably hear back from them, but it might be the next day or after the weekend or some such. But sometimes the message would get lost and you'd have to try them again later.

[Margm]

1 hour ago, Patty65 said:

So much of the voices around me sound like tin.

Patty, that is why I would have a hard time finding a counselor.  It has to come from someone who has experienced grief.  I don't wish that on anyone though.

And, I talk to Billy all the time.  I look up at the moon and talk to him.  Some nights like last night watching the game, I felt he could see it too.  He never talks to me, but sometimes I feel a closeness, maybe just in my head, but whatever it is, I will take it.  I am him and he is me.  

[kayc]

On 9/11/2016 at 9:47 AM, TerriL said:

I'm beginning to wonder if I may be the one who died and I'm living in Hell right now. In the past week, I have been waiting for help that still has not come with no phone call to explain either, I've texted several people and not one has answered me back. I'm thinking maybe they can't hear or see me. Maybe it's like the Sixth Sense movie and I only think I'm still here. Maybe this house is Hell and being without Paul is the sentence I'm serving. Maybe my brother in law is actually Satan. (That would at least explain a lot.) Am I really writing this? Can any of you see this? I may sound nuts, but maybe that's just the point I'm getting to. But, the way I'm being treated by the people who supposedly LOVE me? It might not be all that far-fetched a theory after all. 

I had a chuckle at the "maybe my BIL is actually Satan...that would explain a lot."  

I've learned I can't count on other people.  I definitely could use help sometimes, but it's just not forthcoming.  I have to do everything myself or pay to have it done...which would be a whole lot easier if I actually had money.  

[kayc]

18 hours ago, Marg M said:

I feel a closeness, maybe just in my head, but whatever it is, I will take it.

Me too, Marg.  I believe we will be together again, and like I always said, if anyone knows different, don't tell me!  Do NOT burst my bubble, I need it!

[kayc]

My electricity has been out today, it's going to be out again, I just don't know when, so don't anybody think I'm ignoring them!

[Margm]

50 minutes ago, kayc said:

Do NOT burst my bubble,

I won't burst it, I need every hint possible and if I have to hunt for them, that is okay too..  

[Gin]

I know I have mentioned my son before.    He is 44 and living in California.  He worked for the power company and fell from a high tower.  He had 2 hip replacements.  Now he needs back surgery.  He lives alone in an RV park.  I got text messages from him tonight saying something is wrong with his legs.  He is worried that there might be a bone infection.  He is going to the clinic tomorrow.  He said he was not eating well and does not sleep.  Most of my questions go unanswered.  I am so concerned about him and do not know what I can do.  I have no phone numbers of friends there.  This is so hard without Al.  He used to calm me down.